Non-Medical Alternatives - 2

Over the decades I have struggled w/anxiety & depression, been round & round the medication carousel...
I didn’t enjoy the side effects of any of the meds (& I always seemed to get the worst aspects of them) - Lexapro, Wellbutrin, Trazodone, Zoloft... About the only one I refused to try was Prozac, since I swore that if I gained any more weight I WOULD be suicidal!!!
(My attempt at a joke in poor taste; what can I say? Humor is one of my coping mechanisms)
So I’ve fallen back on what I call my “3-legged stool” of diet, exercise, & the never ending struggle for a decent night’s sleep (chronic insomnia has been a symptom since childhood).
But I did pick up a bottle of CBD oil when I was in NM - can’t say that it did much for me, but I didn’t take it consistently & promptly misplaced it shortly after I got back home.
Last month I cooked up some cannabis butter & made a batch of pot brownies, but I don’t enjoy the spaced-out feeling of sensimilla so THC is out for this girl too - the only good thing I can say is at least there is no hangover as for alcohol!
I do take Vit D & a magnesium supplement since last year’s blood tests showed me to be slightly deficient; these do seem to help my insomnia.
As we head into the winter months (my symptoms worsen in wintertime w/probable SAD aspects) I will be concentrating on nutrient density in my diet since I’m working on peeling off those last 20 lbs. It HAS been good for my mood to maintain the hard-fought 30 lbs I’ve lost thus far!

You used to be able to do that test on-line with instant results. Now it is in PDF form where you have to total it all yourself. I find it is a fairly accurately view or where we are at. I would keep that test, and redo it in a week or two and see what happens. If it still comes back 'moderately depressed' then I suggest that you speak with your Dr. Perhaps take the questionnaire and results with you for your Dr to peruse.

If anyone wants to print it out then please do so, and keep them for your Dr's appointments if you are worried. .
www.jaxhealth.com/app/files/public/1
01
61/burns-depression.pdf

Kris

I am reading Feeling Good again by David D. Burns, M.D. and just took the self-test and it determined that I am moderately depressed. This surprised me. My mom said it was because I've been sick physically but that is not it. It's all the self-esteem questions and feeling hopeless/discouraged. I hope this book helps me out.

Update: I talked to my psychiatrist and she says that the CBD oil actually messes with my medications that she prescribes. For example, she did not think my Pristiq was working while taking it. She said would I rather take medications that are approved by the FDA or this CBD Oil? No. Something to think about though for the future. I hope in the future the FDA approves CBD oil for more things. Although I am happy it helps epilepsy children and such. I saw a thing about it with a little girl Charlotte who was 5. I started watching the movie out by CNN called Weed. I told her I would be reading the book I have for educational purposes and brought the book to show her but would not be taking the oil.

The book I got from amazon. It is called CBD A Patient's Guide to Medicinal Cannabis by Leonard Leinow and Juliana Birnbaum. I am bringing it to my appointment with my psychiatrist on Thursday.

It is a good idea to still discuss this with your Doctor. Where did you get the book from?

Kris

Just an update: feel so much better without the CBD oil. Still going to discuss with doctor. Sent oil back yesterday fed ex. Got book on it and am reading it for informational purposes.

I actually tried the oil and now I am sending it back! I found out that Hempworx is not a good brand so to speak and am going to talk to my psychiatrist before trying again. I also ordered a book about CBD oil for education/research. I joined a Facebook group called CBD Oil Education in the US or something like that. They have a list of good companies like Lazarus Naturals is one. Thank you for all the help. Also Lazarus only costs $40 as opposed to the amount I paid! I hope I get my money back. I spoke to the lady who told me about Hempworx and she was fine with my decisions and was nice about it. It seemed to work for me but caused an increase in suicidal thoughts so I am definitely talking to the doctor before trying again. I heard that is a side effect and also a side effect of the medications I am on. Thank you so much for your help/support.

Take the bottle with you to the Psychiatrist, but also have packaging ready to post it back that day, if she recommends that you do that, because the time line would be cutting it fine to leave it another day.

Kris

ONE HUNDRED BUCKS???? WOW

I wonder if they stand by their refund guarantee?

Kris

I just realized I can send the bottle back within 30 days of getting it!!!!! Even if it is empty they said. Ha! I might not even open it so they would get a full bottle back from me.

Okay thank you Kris. I will do some more research on whether it is illegal and stuff for New York state. I live in upstate NY. I see my psychiatrist on August 23rd and will discuss it with her. I hope I didn't just waste almost $100!!!!

@SLBROOKS3 you NEED to discuss this with your Psychiatrist BEFORE you start using it. The fact that you are already on medications, regardless of the reason and what they are makes it even MORE important that you discuss this with your Dr prior to using. This is a copy/paste of the Medical News Today article updated just a few days ago:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~

"Side effects of other uses of CBD

There is often a lack of evidence regarding the safety of new or alternative treatment options, as they have not been fully tested.

Anyone who is considering using CBD should talk to a qualified healthcare practitioner before use.

The FDA have not approved CBD for the treatment of any condition, except for two rare and severe forms of epilepsy.

When drugs do not have FDA approval, it can be difficult to know whether a product contains a safe or effective level of CBD or whether the product has the properties and contents stated on its packaging and marketing.

Marijuana use in pregnancy has been linked to impairments in the growing baby's neurons. Regular use by teens is associated with memory, behavior, or intelligence problems."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~

Your Psychiatrist will NOT be disappointed or tee'd off that you are exploring various avenues, but rather very pleased with you, particularly the fact that you discussing it with her!!!!

Another thing you must consider are the legal ramifications of using it, depending on where you live. In some places it is illegal, and in other places you need to show that you have tried so many other 'traditional' meds but that they don't work or cause worse problems. This applies to various States withing the USA as well as various countries.

Let us know what she says.

Kris

Edited by: SLIMMERKIWI at: 8/1/2018 (01:03)

Has anyone in this group tried CBD oil. I am very nervous about trying it but I gave in and ordered a bottle when I saw a video about a man who had depression try it. My depression is not that bad but if I can help it even more I thought I would give it a try.

I am nervous about talking to my psychiatrist about this because she may say it is a bad idea. I am on 3 medications right now which I am not stopping.

I know this may be controversial but I thought I would bring it up in this part of the group.

Thanks.

I am on viibryd which took me a long time to be okay with. I fought for a long time to not take meds but I do feel better. It is the getting up and going that is truly hard for me as well as not letting my emotions be an excuse to stay in bed. I'm trying online counseling for now until I transition to a swing shift instead of graveyard. That shift does not help with my mental health issues at all.

Its hard to be modivated but exercising has helped me. Sometimes yoga or a zumba class is a fun away but even just a short walk outside can help over time. it does take some consistancy to see the effects.

I tried therapist and mrds and didnt get much good luck. The meds made me gain weight and feel weird. The only therapist that helped doesnt take my ins so I'm not really doing that.

Edited by: HEALTH4LIFE2012 at: 8/19/2017 (18:46)

Magnesium does wonders for me. Epsom salts in bath or foot soak or even warm, wet washcloth on the head. Or Natural Calm powder in a drink, higher priced than the salts though. Take it about an hour before you want to be asleep. Magnesium exchanges with calcium in the muscles to aid in relaxing and contracting, it's an off switch

Thanks for the advice. I do not have insurance to go to the doctor. B12 is OTC vitamins. Will try to make myself do a few minute walk see how it goes.

Have a good talk with your Dr about what is going on. It could be that there is something medical contributing to the problem. You should ask your Dr about a referral to a Therapist and also to a Registered Dietitian. Between them they may be the answer for you.

I hope that the B12 Vitamins were prescribed??? If not, you could actually do yourself harm. The need to be prescribed only AFTER the Dr has done bloods, and if the results indicate that it is needed.

Ensure that you eat a healthy, balanced diet, with plenty of fruit/veges, and lean protein.

Are you getting exercise? I know it sounds counter-productive, but going for (even a) 10-15 minute walk each day can turn around the excess tiredness during the day and help you to sleep at night.

Good luck,
Kris

I have severe insomnia and have been very depressed for months. I go to work every day and homeschool my son then lay on the couch the majority of the day too exhausted to do anything. I've tried b12 vitamins. Not helping. I really need to exercise and lose weight but am always tired. I'm kinda lost.

I do everything here and it does work wonders. At the end of the day though, my Chihuahua is the sure way to get through a bad spell

I mostly make necklaces. I want to experiment with bracelets soon. Using old jewlery and other inexpensive costume jewelry can be the most rewarding. I have taken old necklaces and changed them into a new piece. I find that each piece I make is definitely a learning experience. There are kits with the basic tools and usually a pattern with beads to make. Sometimes jumping in is the best way to learn.
What I make is very basic. Usually the beaded necklace and a drop bead focal.

HungryWoman - what do you make with beads? I've been interested in making beads and bead jewelry for awhile now, but never have. I collected a bunch of old costume jewelry to take apart to make other stuff with. I even bought a dremel kit to work with stones and wood, but never have done a think with it.

It is a good idea to exercise when you can. I try and refocus when depressed. If I am able, I will work with my beads, which seem to have a calming effect. My cat is also good therapy for me.

i agree exercise is tremendous for depression. i also take vitD. my prob is that exercise seems futile and impossible when depressed. so i try to maintain an exercise schedule and at least during my "up" days (which are most), i know i am helping to boost mood.

Hi HOLLI64 - welcome aboard.

It sounds like you have a good handle on the alternatives :-)

I quite like "Happy", too, and find that they way he delivers it compared to others who have sung it, is more uplifting.

Good luck with the sleeping.

Kris

I've been studying and using herbals and supplements for years, and I find that large doses of Vit. D, iodine therapy (for my thyroid) and lots of exercise have really helped me, especially exercise. If I get depressed, I can go for a walk or do some step aerobics and instantly feel better.

Also, I go to YouTube and watch comedian's videos. Laughter sometimes is the best medicine. I also have playlists of happy, cheerful songs that make me want to get up and dance around the room, which brings my spirts way up. My favorite uplifting songs are "Happy" by Pharrell and "Walking on Sunshine." You just can't sit still listening ot those two. Try it!

Well, I'm going to go to bed now. Haven't been sleeping well lately, so I'm tired.

i disagree w the statement below that a therapist is useless and that we should rely upon our pets and friends only and ditch the therapist. i think that can be harmful advice. my therapist lends insight into things that my friends would have no clue about. she's highly trained and very intelligent. she helps me analyze whereas friends might just sympathize. i don;t recommend ditching the therapist! get one that takes insurance, they are not expensive that way. def worth it!

I also love a good meditation. Try googling Silva Method meditations and try the deep relax and the short relax. There are several versions to choose from and I just found a voice I liked because the words are the same regardless of who is doing it. If your in an area the offers Silva Method classes I highly recommend them. I took the ones in Casa Grande AZ offered by PHDs Tony Estrada and Joan McGillicuddy. It was life changing. I even took my 11 year old daughter to it as well. Taught us both how to get in touch with our intuitions and use as much of our brain as possible. 13 years later it still seems to help. Many blessings.

Just started exercising 5 days ago after not exercising for 9 months. the first day was totally treacherous but today already I was able to get on the floor for abs and cool down during 40 minutes strength/cardio workout. Hitting goals like that really helps me to eat healthier without even realizing. And I feel the goodness of the sun too.

Edited by: RAIN4MARYANN at: 7/10/2016 (18:29)

I find that light, particularly sunlight helps to lift my mood. Another alternative which works for me is a special lamp 30 minutes regularly.

I also find regular exercise to be a huge benefit to my mental health. I also find meditation helps in many ways. I follow guided meditations on YouTube daily. Here are some of my favorites:

Morning Uplift:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpxX
FxSNCF8

Weight-Loss:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=a747
iJ5uVlY

I do those back-to-back every morning. The second one is also a positive affirmation in addition to be targeted towards weight-loss. In total, the two videos are under 10 minutes combined.

For sleep:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJjc
4XreJSQ

Relaxation/Stress Relief:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jyy0
ra2WcQQ

If you have never meditated, or it has been a long time since you did, it will take time. Meditation is a skill, and like any skill, it must be practiced regularly for you to be good at it.

I have found that exercise, even a nice long walk, helps with my depression. Luckily, it also helps with weight loss and weight loss helps with depression too!

I know sometimes it's hard to even drag yourself out of bed or take a shower, let alone exercise when you're depressed, but if you can force yourself to do it, it really does help.

Also, as I mentioned before, there is a site called "Patients Like Me" which proved to be very helpful to me while going through my worst times. You can track your moods and medication there among other things. Plus the Forum is a great place to talk to other people going through the same thing who can give you advice on what has worked for them.

I was only on medication for a short time after losing my last pregnancy around 15 years ago. I now find that routines help keep me from giving in to the depression. A good website for getting started with routine baby steps is flylady.com. She is very encouraging too.

Edited by: RISINGSUN26 at: 3/21/2016 (10:15)

I use chamomile tea sometimes when my stomach's upset, but please do note that it's toxic. Once in a while won't cause any problems, but if you drink it too often...

I have severe anxiety coupled with depression. When pregnant it gets a hundred times worse. I do not in any way shape or form condone going off meds during pregnancy. Pregnancy hormones do some horrible things and if you're like me and already dealing with it; lets just say it's not pretty. My doctor once told me that sometimes you have to weigh the good v. the bad. I take Zoloft which helps with both depression and anxiety. It has not been tested on effects during pregnancy. I have taken it through three of four pregnancies and all my kids are just fine. Doc kept me at a low dose (he doesn't like medicating pregnant women) and let me do the rest. I'm still on the same dose and when combined with diet, exercise, and Vitamin B12 I do okay. I personally don't like counselors; I find that a good friend is cheaper and more receptive. Oh yea and they're less likely to call the men in the white coats on you. I have found next to no counselor that is worth what they charge. Heck I get better results out of talking to my dog. Now there's an idea, get a dog or cat at least they don't judge. If you can't have pets where you live talk to your doctor. A therapy pet is different from a regular pet and is protected under the Americans with Disability Act (ADA).

Edited by: LADYCROW84 at: 11/18/2015 (00:35)

I use an Ott light it is cheaper. I find them at Meijers, joanns, on line at fire mountain gems - I use mine for jewelry making. I am told they are the same type of light. The physiologist I have a class with says they are best used for about 20 minutes in the morning. Then it helps with keeping your Arcadian rhythm in balance.

Have you tried chamomile tea? It is calming. I use a mint blend my Naturopathic Dr son Recommended. It is called Nervine Tea by Wise Woman Herbals.

For my Panic attacks The DBT class I am taking had us make a tool kit with something for each of our senses. I put mine n a velvet bag. Some put theirs on their cell phone- does not matter just so you know where and what. So I have sight- family pictures, taste- A piece of chocolate, sound- jewelry with bells on it and a CD, touch- a piece of leather, smell- a bottle of peppermint oil. I use it any time I get anxious. It is amazing how well it works.

Hope that helps.

If you aren't already in Therapy, I suggest that you talk with your Dr and as for a referral to a Therapist who will be a great help, in that he/she will be able to give you the tools to help overcome your anxiety - both now and in the future.

Good luck,
Kris

I'm in my last month of slowly weening myself off my anxiety meds. My husband and I want a baby and I need off these meds. What I'm trying to do now is come up with other things I can do to curb my anxiety/depression in a natural way.

I've already begun working out and am trying to cut back on caffeine. I know that green tea is supposed to be helpful as well. Are there any other alternatives that you guys can suggest?

Miller in reference to your post dated 10/6/12....... I am not sure about just Niacin but I do know that after I changed to a vegetarian diet my GP put on a daily dose of B12. I haven't been a big meat eater for many years so I think there had been s few underlying issues creeping into my life for a while. Late last year I thought I didn't really need it but a couple of months later I felt a distinct downward trend in my emotions & energy levels plus a few other weird things. I went back on it & felt so much better for it. It was proof enough for me that I definitely needed to take it & will never go off it again. I do know that as we age the Vitamin B12 aren't absorbed as easily as they used to be & it is quite common for the elderly to be put on a B12 supplement.

I have had some excellent luck with a nutritional tea made from a plant called moringa. went from being barely able to drive 40 miles to riding my exercise bike cumulative 26.4 mi the other day.

Other improvements -- I also danced at a dance event 5 hours, have been doing light farm work here and there, lost a few pounds (4 from my high). I even fought fire during spring burning. Not bad for 6 months effort.

Apparently the manufacturer makes a difference (Zija). I saw a friend go from barely walking to equally vigorous - she invited me to one of the direct sale presentations. I don't like those as a rule and the stuff is spendy - but I have greatly reduced dr visits and adjusted some other things. I'd spend that amount to feel good.

I deal with depression (largely in remission) and one other disabling condition - I'm rather pleased with things now. Even lost my sweet tooth, toned up to the extent there has been positive comment. Mostly I feel good and can do more, For the record, not a sales rep, do know one. EMDR counseling was also a significant and positive help for the thought style that was intensifying the depression. Once in a while I can't even remember what was tormenting my thought - or why. It's not a long term treatment. And there are easy exercises I can do when stress shows up. Hope this is useful to someone! It's not a cure ALL but I'm 90% improved from this winter. Good luck, whatever you choose to do or not do.



Edited by: WALLOWA at: 6/13/2015 (09:19)

Can I just say I've had a really hard last several months? Long story short I've been struggling with serious anxiety which has really exacerbated my depression. I finally noticed that the anxiety corresponds with my monthly cycle and after telling two different doctors I finally fell into the hands of an FNP who tested my blood and confirmed a huge lack of progesterone. I'm happy to say that this month I've muddled through a long series of stressful stuff and had only one big meltdown and a little one.
Topic jumping, I react badly to depression medicines, but I've used a light therapy box for many years with noticeable positive results. I've also found that the right music first thing in the morning helps me quite a bit.

Thank you Kris for the tip, I track a lot of things, wether here or in a journal... I've noticed winter's difficult, same thing if I don't get enough sleep, or if it's close to TOM, the long rainy days I can cope with if it's not the same gray weather for the whole week... I might as well track a bit more of my surroundings.

Have a good weekend!

Isabelle ☼

Perhaps if you keep a diary and include your nutrition (not just calories, fats, etc.), what kind of day re overcast, sunny, etc., how you felt, and any other factor that could affect you. In time you might find a pattern. I tend to do this with a lot of issues. I use a spreadsheet format because it seems to be the easiest way to go through and identify that pattern.

Thyroid issues DO impact a lot with mood etc., so hopefully the majority of your issues were caused by that.

Good luck,
Kris

I started depression meds back in 2007, I used to take Omega 3's with it. Then, 3 years ago, we changed (because it wasn't doing anymore good) for an anxiety med - which I have been taking consistently - the side effects when I miss one day are ridiculously difficult to manage!

So, Winter 2013 : anxiety med + wellbutrin (it's also a pill but used to give you a boost)
Winter 2014 : anxiety med (lowest available) + light therapy + thyroid med
Winter 2015 : anxiety med + thyroid med

Winter's difficult for me but not this year, well, not as much. So I am thinking, because we found out I have thyroid problems, maybe I don't need this anxiety pill anymore? Maybe the thyroid problems are the ones responsible for my "depressed" mood? (that could be SPM too!) Also, I finaly got to see a psychiatrist and we talked for a good 2 hours and he thought that maybe I had a borderline kind of personality - and reading about it, it makes sens and knowing helps me to control myself and to know why I act a certain way.

So... about the "other" options, I can easily go back to Omega 3's if needed, I eat mostly primal, I exercise... any other advices?

That sounds like the best form of exercise - it's FUN and you are with other people forming friendships in the process :-)

Kris

Hi again! Sorry for the delayed response... but just wanted to let you know I finally got together with a new group of people and did a hike (in snow, in weather in the 20s, but hey). It was fun and active, and I'm hoping to plug in with that group when I can! :)

Yeh - fingers crossed!!!

When I was going to Pilates, an RN came to the class sometimes. It depended on what shift she was on. If it was a night shift, she would finish work and then drive over an hour directly to the class, and then go home for her meal and bed. If it was a day shift, she went to the same Pilates studio, but took a different time slot. Maybe this is something that you could think about, if you decide to join an exercise group. Just talk with those taking the classes to see if they can accommodate your specific needs.

Good luck,
Kris xxx

Thanks for the encouragement, Kris. I sure hope something eventually works! As far as plugging in goes, it's a great idea; I'm in a new town and don't know many people, so it's really lonely, which isn't helpful overall. But with my work schedule, I rotate among 4 shifts at a 24-hour agency and work different days and a different shift every single week (and up to 3 different shifts in a week). Besides wreaking havoc on sleep schedules, this means I cannot commit to any recurring activity because I'm never guaranteed to be free the same time or day week to week. There's a chance our shifts will be organized differently starting in a couple months and I might actually get steady hours. If that change actually takes place, I'll be in a much better place to plug in. :) Here's hoping!

hmmm - sounds like you are kind-of between a rock and a hard place at the moment. Don't give up hope, because I am POSITIVE that something will turn up - the unfortunate part is that it may not be right now.

Have you tried joining a small group of something that you may be interested in? Perhaps a little exercise class (Yoga or Pilates would be great), or handcraft (think pottery, jewelry making etc.) It COULD provide some therapy which helps with the depression. Just a thought, but one worth thinking about if you haven't already.

HUGS,
Kris

Thanks for the reply, Kris... actually, have been under the care of a psychiatrist the whole time. Have tweaked meds, added, subtracted, etc. Was alcohol-free, only took other prescribed meds for sleep and blood pressure (mine was low; I had to raise it with meds) off and on. Ate pretty well, exercised various amounts, but never cut it out entirely, and have seen counselors off and on as needed. Pretty fed up with not seeing results for this long; not sure what to try next!

Can I ask, who was monitoring you with your meds? A GP or a Psychiatrist? Were your medications reviewed regularly? I ask this because sometimes a person goes to a Psychiatrist once, and then that is it, or they are diagnosed by their GP and the prescriptions come from them, but if you are properly assessed by a Psychiatrist, and have regular contact with them, including telling them accurately how you are feeling etc., they can tweak your medications to give good results.

The other thing that needs to be asked; while you were on your meds, what was your lifestyle like? i.e., did you:
* Drink alcohol?

* Take any other medication, prescribed or not?

* Consume a healthy diet including plenty of fresh fruit/veges and lean protein, and with good portion control?

* Get any form of exercise?

* Have any form of therapy?

They are all ways of helping to improve your energy levels, as well as help with depression.

Just food for thought!
Kris

Really searching for a way to manage well without meds. Recently got off all my bipolar meds, and want to stay off, but struggle with depression, anxiety, and sleep. Feel like I have tried everything - healthy eating, essential oils, yoga, exercise - though maybe haven't stuck with anything long enough. Was on meds 5 years and was depressed and low-energy much of that time; also still struggled with mood swings. Was hoping getting off meds would improve something - at least maybe the energy, but it hasn't so far. Wishing I had a miracle cure I could just jump into and never look back! Haven't found it yet.... Just doing my best day to day, but not thriving. What's the best thing you've found to work for going it med-free?

I actually get summer SAD because my lupus keeps me trapped in the house because of the heat. I also have winter SAD, so there are only a few months out of the year when I'm happy. No way to live.

I do use a light for SAD though I have depression all year, it is worse in the winter. I do believe that it helps a lot. You need to use it for 30 minutes in the morning upon waking. Your eyes must be open as the light is absorbed via the pineal gland through the pupil. I usually read or journal which is a nice way to start the day too.

I will try she won't be in till Tuesday.

Please make an appointment with your Dr ASAP! Altho' you are doing it for financial reasons, and not 'just because' you are playing with fire. There are many ways of accessing medications for free or much cheaper. Your Dr will be able to discuss this with you. If you have any issues after that, please come back here because I can give you links to places that can help.

Good luck, and PLEASE take care!
Kris xxx

I have tried to cut back on my meds my GP doesn't know this, but I find that it's not working very well. I was trying to save some money and there are only certain pharmacys that take my insurance. I'm on so many meds it just feels like I'm a robot . Today is an ok day. No highs or lows just kind of blah .