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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 10,408
1/8/15 10:27 A

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hi atria!
yes you did mention you were taking your stress b every other day! Good idea to avoid too much, bc its just one more thing that our bodies have to work to eliminate. The reason I suggested splitting the pill is bc our bodies need B vitamins every day, and splitting them and taking the same dose will lead to more consistent levels of b- vitamin in the blood, with less extreme peaks and valleys.

B vitamins support the adrenals, which are key players in our bodies. Adrenals also need vitamin C. Eating veggies and fruit high in vitamin C is the best way to get it.

Chromium is supposed to help with blood sugar.
It's also in nutritional yeast.

Have a fun day!
: )
Mzzchief

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1/8/15 7:45 A

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Oh yeah good call on the B complex. I forgot to mention I've been taking it every other day because a lot of the stuff on there is 100+% of my daily intake which is crazy! Interesting about the ground pepper + CoQ-10 route, but yeah, since I'm not having those issues (right now, we'll see with the dietary changes), I can spend my money on something else.

Thanks!

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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 10,408
1/7/15 7:15 P

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Hi Atria!

B complex vitamins are good, its best to take them in the morning bc for some people, (those deficient in B12), they tend to give one energy and that's not something you want at nite unless you work the nite shift!

Also most B complexes tend to really overdose, so you might want to break your tablet in half or even quarters. I use a mult-B from Thorne. Its in a capsule form... I just pull the capsule apart, knock a bit out on a spoon and take it that way. B vitamins only last about 24 hours in the body, so that's why its good to dose once a day.

I also split a 2mg dose of Chromium in half.

CoQ10 (Ubiquinone) is a good one, and even better one bc its more bioavailable is its sister Ubiquinol.

You can increase the absorption of CoQ10 by taking it with ground black pepper, bc black pepper contains Piperine, a substance that works synergistically with CoQ10, increasing its absorption. Some CoQ10 supplements have piperine added to them for this reason. Ubiquinol doesn't need Piperine.


Let me see if I can find something on that so you don't have to take my word for it:

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10715596

Yes CoQ10/ubiquinol supplements are expensive.
I have mixd raw CoQ10 powder(its bright yellow orange) with MCT coconut oil (MCT stays liquid in the fridge, which is where I store it), to make my own supplement which helps with the expense. Plus I know what I'm getting.

CoQ10 is good for the heart and blood vessels.
If you are having heart palps or circulation issues then it might be just the thing for you!
Its also supposed to help with energy.
Some people on statins use it, since they lower the level of CoQ10 in the body, often resulting in muscle aches and cramps.
And its used by some to help with gum problems since those with gingivitis often have low levels of Co Q10 in their gum tissue.
Its supposed to enhance your skin too.

That said it is made in the body and if you are young and don't have any of these problems, then its prolly best to save your money for something you need that better suits your unique situation.

: )
Mzzchief

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1/7/15 11:23 A

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Wow, so much information here! I have been taking NatureMade Stress B-Complex and Nature's Bounty Chromium Picolinate (both every other day). Not sure if they're helping, but I'd heard they were helpful for a number of reasons. I have also heard good things about CoQ-10 but I'm not sure if I want to take it, as it's kind of expensive. Has anyone heard about any of these?

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GOANNA2's Photo GOANNA2 Posts: 23,949
12/18/14 6:59 P

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I always learn something from you Mzz. HAVE A GREAT DAY!

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12/15/14 8:46 P

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Cat

There are all sorts of combinations of problems, once you have one autoimmune disease.
For whatever reason low vitamin D, b12 and anemia are a common situation.

Some people become insulin resistant and others don't.
If you're the type of person who is active, has good thyroid numbers, keeps your calories low, is eating a healthy, clean diet, and is scoring in the 90s on your fasting glucose tests, then I think its a good idea to have an Hb1ac test run.

People hold on to weight for a variety of reasons.
One of them is insulin resistance.
The two organs responsible for this seem to be the liver inappropriately releasing glucose when it gets too low, and the pancreas which is either not putting out enough insulin, or is putting out an appropriate amount, but it can't dock in cells. So the sugar stays in the blood, causing damage.

: )
Mzzchief

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12/15/14 3:24 P

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Y'all are sooooooo blooming smart. I have learned so much from y'all.

Is there a connection with hypothyroidism and insulin resistance and B12 issues?

Cat

Life is not about waiting for the storms to pass...
it's about learning how to dance in the rain.


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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 10,408
12/14/14 12:50 P

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Tee

You mentioned in earlier posts that you had Addison's disease which is low adrenal hormones, cortisol being one of them, the other one being aldosterone which helps regulate blood pressure.

Addison's disease is fairly uncommon, thank goodness!

More frequently, people have the opposite problem of inappropriately high cortisol before bed, which keeps them awake. So the goal is to lower cortisol so they can sleep.


For those who are unfamiliar:

Cortisol is secreted in a circadian rhythm, meaning its not at a steady state in our bodies at all times of the day and nite. It ebbs and flows like a tide.

The adrenals start releasing around 3-4 AM.

Cortisol peaks around 8-10 am, which is what wakes you up in the morning.
(People who don't wake up well, frequently don't have adequate cortisol in their system yet, this is also why you sometimes feel sleepy when you have to wake up earlier than your normal time.)

Cortisol declines as the day goes on.
Sometimes you get a "bump" around 3-4 PM in the afternoon.
If you stay awake past about 10:30 PM, your adrenals will sometimes put out an additional bump of cortisol which can keep you awake until 1-2 AM,
Which is why the recommendation is to try and get to bed around 10- 10:30 every nite and stick with that pattern as much as you can to reinforce the circadian tide of cortisol and make it work with you instead of against you.

The lowest amount of cortisol is circulating from midnite to 3-4am, when the cycle starts over again. People whose cortisol is high, can't sleep because its the "wake up" hormone.

People who wake up around 3-4am, its usually bc too much cortisol is being released too quickly, rather than a small amount at a time.

Anyone who has had jet lag, or to a lesser degree experienced the shifts between daylite savings to standard time, or is unexpectedly had to start rising early, has experienced what its like when you are suddenly shifting things around your body's established circadian rhythm.

CAVEAT about Metaformin:
It depletes vitamin B12, which is why its a good idea to take a multi-B supplement as well as making sure you're getting adequate calcium. Here's something about that:
care.diabetesjournals.org/content/23
/9
/1227



Hope everyone's having a fun weekend!
Its raining here... nice, bc we need it, not so nice bc it means my walk and gardening is delayed!
: )
Mzzchief

New decade. Big world.
Hello, 60!
Primum non nocere.

Never underestimate the value of getting out of your own way.

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12/14/14 4:10 A

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Layne,

I had sleep issue before discovering I had low cortisol. Low cortisol causes sleep problems and not sleeping thru the night causes low cortisol. Sort of a catch 22. As soon as my cortisol level normalized, I slept thru the night and lost weight. I was like you before cortisol, renin and aldosterone testing/treatment. I would be out to the world when upon returned home, up during night and tired the next day. Low levels of these hormones were the problem.

I was lucky a contrast MRI for hernia showed I had adrenal tumor which is common. Yet, most patients do not find this out until this type of testing is done. I developed adrenal bleeding last year on Xmas day, which lead to proper testing and treatment. I realized after reviewing my medical records that I had these symptoms 7 years before being diagnosed and treated.

I gained a lot of weight and belly/hip fat when I took levoxyl and metformin. I started gaining when doc prescribed one Metformin tablet daily. She said when I took 2-3 tablets daily, I would start losing. That did not happen. I gained 30 lbs before my kidneys stopped working and Met was discontinued. I was given Met for insulin resistance, which I did not have. I had low cortisol and electrolytes. A doctor explained that thyroid medication does not work with low cortisol and/or dehydrated. My thyroid levels, etc are fine now.






Tee

Middle age is when broadness of the mind and narrowness of the waist change places.


Whatever you do in life, think higher and feel deeper. C. Artias

Your personal history is not your true identity. Don't let the past define who you are.. Eckart Tolle

You are the architect of your actions, words and voice. What an opportunity for love, truth and purpose to shine. Sister Andrea Jaegar

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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 10,408
12/12/14 11:00 P

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HI Granny!

The insulin resistance thing, sad to say I have that too, and its horrible.
My problem is that my blood sugar spikes big time after meals.

I'm not on any drugs to regulate it yet, I'm trying to avoid them by modifying my diet (restricting carbs,virtually no grains, eating fish, limiting dairy especially milk, eating lots of veggies), adding herbs (Gynostemma, chamomile) taking supplements (chromium, biotin, taurine, b-vitamins), getting daily exercise (yoga, gardening, walking), losing weight.

The problem with insulin resistance is that it makes it very difficult to lose weight.
But it can be done. I'm losing at about one pound a week.

I've found Gynostemma to be very helpful.
I wrote a blog on it and posted it several places.
I drink a cup of the leaves which I make in a big pot every morning with other herbs, and reheat as needed.
Drink it 20 minutes before I eat anything.
If I am making a soup, I throw some Gynostemma leaves in there.

I have some mulberry leaf tea coming this weekend, excited about that, bc its supposed to help lower blood glucose, too.

Vinegar worked for a while, but then it lost its effectiveness.
I still use it from time to time with meals... I'll put it on my veggies or just drink a tablespoon in water.

I found I can sleep all nite if I have a protein snack an hour or so before bed.
I love greek yogurt with a small amount of honey and sesame seeds.
Sesame seeds are packed with all sorts of good trace minerals and have fiber.
I use the Plain Great Value brand (at Walmart) 0% fat Greek Yogurt, its yummy, full of calcium which is relaxing, protein and probiotics. And its inexpensive.
Raw honey which is delicious... but you can't pour it all over the yogurt or you will really spike your postprandial glucose! Stick with no more than a tablespoon, less is even better.
I usually just take a pinch of Gynostemma leaves before I eat it, chew them up and wash them down with some water to blunt the postprandial glucose spike.

I kinda had to rearrange my head about food, due to the insulin resistance thing.
I try to look at it as a game, figuring out what works for my body, rather than a deprivation.
That makes the whole thing an adventure, rather than a"woe is me" experience!

O my, when I am naughty and eat something that spikes my sugar I can feel it coming like a freight train, its like taking a sleeping pill. I want to avoid that feeling at all costs.

So I'd say watch your carbs closer, the nutrition tracker is super helpful with that... measure and weigh your carbs, don't rely on the eyeball method.

You might also find that some carbs make you sleepier than others... if so you'll want to stop eating those.

I try to keep my carbs under 32 per meal. Include lean protein with each meal and fiber, that seems to help.

: )
Mzzchief




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Hello, 60!
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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 10,408
12/12/14 10:31 P

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Hey guys!

Sorry I haven't had time to get to the second pill.
Still mega busy here.
Haven't forgotten, though!

: )
Mzzchief

New decade. Big world.
Hello, 60!
Primum non nocere.

Never underestimate the value of getting out of your own way.

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12/12/14 7:02 P

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MZZ - Thank you very much....That does explain why the sleeping aid is recommended. It was developed by scientists at MIT. I like it because I wake up fresher without the brain fog.

I truly appreciate the time you take to answer the questions so thouroughly.

Granny - I can tell you what I'm taking for sleep. It also helps my daughter. It isn't medication just natural herbs. It is doing wonders....I just wanted to know WHY it worked. I'm wierd like that. ;-)






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GRANNYWIZARD's Photo GRANNYWIZARD SparkPoints: (3,892)
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12/11/14 5:02 P

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Hi you two.
I had to come see what supplements I could use for hyperthyroid and it's range of symptoms.
MZZ: I was drawn to the lemon balm because I grew it along with others in the mint family. The Lemon balm seemed calming but so did the other mints and I used a variety of them in my tea blends.

I take Metoprolol for symptoms and heart rate and it has helped many of them. I was started on methimazole just a few weeks ago. But, it's a low dose since my free's were in the normal range while the TSH was .01. It is amazing to me I was having a bunch of horrible symptoms and my TSH was the only one that was off. I gained weight too instead of losing like most people said.

I'm not really sure what to do yet for my sleep issues. I won't take sleeping aides as I think it will make my problems worse.
I barely make it through the day and when I fall into bed, I'm GONE. In a couple hours I'm AWAKE..... I'd like to see what works for others. I'm guessing the extreme tiredness might be from being insulin resistant, I'm on metformin and a high protein, low carb diet. The tiredness and waking up continue for me. If I didn't work at all I would take a nap everyday but that is not possible.

Any suggestions?

Note: I still feel like everything that I've experienced in this last 2 years has been the autoimmune disease. I'm not even clear on what the underlying cause of having hyperthyroidism even is or if I will ever get this resolved where I feel good.

Edited by: GRANNYWIZARD at: 12/11/2014 (17:06)
"The only person you are destined to become is the person you decide to be." ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson




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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 10,408
12/8/14 11:55 A

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Hi Dette!

Thanks for your questions!
As well as the nice things you said about me, those don't hurt either!

Dette, I only have time to deal with one supplement, promise I will get to the other supplement later on in the day. I've got too much to do here in noncyber land!

I'll write about the first one, since that's the one you are currently taking... the sleep aid.

When I first looked at your list of ingredients, I was puzzled bc they all looked like fillers( to give the pill bulk to fill the capsule, stuff like microcrystaline cellulose), excipients ( stuff added to the ingredients so that they "flow" into the capsule and don't get stuck up on the machinery.. magnesium stearate, stearate, silicon dioxide). Silicon dioxide also helps absorb water so that the ingredients don't clump up inside the pill. I didn't see any "active".

And I thought, oh no, a homeopathic medicine, which I am firmly against, bc they are distilled to the point where they only contain the "vibrations" of the active... no active whatsoever.

But I followed your link and saw that the actives were listed under the box image.
Some of the herbs there are ones I have recommended to people.
Magnolia extract which is good for adrenals... ie calming anxiety, its the main ingredient in Relora.
Lemon Balm, which I grow in summer and add to tea and food( mostly fish dishes), a member of the mint family, its known for calming and balance. (I use it bc of the taste) It can be somewhat controversial for low thyroid, but is used sometimes to tame the symptoms of hyperthyroid disease.
L-theonine which I use sometimes before bed, if I'm feeling antsy and its time to sleep. Its an active found in tea, its why in part you can drink tea and not get the jitters the way you do with coffee. Of course tea has less caffiene than coffee.
Melatonin which we all know about, its released by the pineal gland ( also our digestive track), in response to darkness ( or a heavy meal which is one reason why food relaxes us). I like that its in a good amount here. 0.5 mg, not the ridiculous 3 mg that's in most supplements.

The rest of the ingredients I've heard of at some time of another, but have not personally taken.

As for your other questions, why would a sleeping aid help your thyroid disease, I would say that sleep is of vital importance, bc its then when our bodies repair themselves and our brains and nervous system is giving a rest... as well as a cleansing

www.npr.org/blogs/health/2013/10/18/
23
6211811/brains-sweep-themselves-cleaR>n-of-toxins-during-sleep


Our disease is autoimmune and TARGETS the thyroid gland, there's nothing "wrong" with our thyroid glands themselves... well at least not in the beginning before scarring from autoimmune attacks permanently alter the structure and therefore the function of the gland.

Unfortunately our current model of thyroid disease treatment is to alleviate symptoms by providing the body with thyroid hormone, it never addresses the true cause of our problem, which is autoimmunity.

Some of the other herbs in the nighttime formula have a reputation for being immune system modulating, but I don't know if there's enuf in the active "proprietary formula" to make a real difference... a pill is pretty small and there is microcellulose in the pill... filler.

That's why for me, I like to take the whole, fresh or dried herb whenever possible.
Or take a pill where the filler is something like leucine or primrose oil... something that's actually good for me.

That's great you are getting a benefit from these pills.

Gotta get outside.
Have a fun day!
: )
Mzzchief


New decade. Big world.
Hello, 60!
Primum non nocere.

Never underestimate the value of getting out of your own way.

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12/7/14 9:55 P

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You may be interested in article below: I sleep and feel more relaxed and refreshed when I take magnesium supplement with dinner.

hypothyroidmom.com/anxiety-panic-att
ac
ks-depression-mood-swings-the-thyroiR>d-roller-coaster-ride/


Tee

Middle age is when broadness of the mind and narrowness of the waist change places.


Whatever you do in life, think higher and feel deeper. C. Artias

Your personal history is not your true identity. Don't let the past define who you are.. Eckart Tolle

You are the architect of your actions, words and voice. What an opportunity for love, truth and purpose to shine. Sister Andrea Jaegar

Accept each moment as if you had chosen it. That frees you


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12/7/14 6:01 P

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O.K. I was told to take two supplements and that they would help my thyroid issues. I was told by someone who takes both supplements daily AND she is now off her thyroid meds. She was Hypothyroid. I've got Hashimotos.

One of the supplements is a sleeping aid. I do not have trouble sleeping but as I had some in the house I decided to give it a try. Over one week I woke up less tired and without brain fog. I do think I'm even sleeping better. Here are the ingredients:



Why would a sleeping aid help my Thyroid?

Vegetable capsule (natural vegetable cellulose, water), magnesium stearate, stearic acid, silicon dioxide, microcrystalline cellulose.

More supplement facts: I can not copy to this page but here is the link that will take you to the supplemental info.....It looks like ingredients but listed separately.

www.qivanaproducts.com/product/qore-
pm
/


The other supplement is a nitric oxide activator.. Haven't taken it yet.


Supplemental info:

www.qivanaproducts.com/product/prime
-n
-o-activator/


Other ingredients: Fructose (natural sweetener), Natural Flavors and Citric Acid.

I've tried reading through all the scientific stuff but it is a bit over my head. I'm just hoping you might see some ingredients that will ring a bell for you. You are probably the most knowledgeable person I have ever met regarding my thyroid. Doctors included.

Thanks for taking the time to look.





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