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RUSSELL_40's Photo RUSSELL_40 Posts: 16,826
5/26/14 8:29 A

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I tend to eat higher protein ( about 20-25 % ), but then about 65% fat, and just 10-12 % carbs.

To keep fat high, I eat 2 ozs. macadamia nuts for my snack. That is 420 calories, and 42 grams of fat ( 90 % fat ). Then I just add olive oil to my lunch and dinner to get my fat % right. Breakfast is always 2 XL eggs, and 2 Tbsp butter.

I would also agree that when you eat low carb, and see a dish, that two things will stick out to you. One is that if you have 2.5 cups of broccoli, cooked up with some oil and 8 ozs of diced chicken, it won't seem like a lot of food by volume. Even less if you were to eat it with green beans. It just looks like 2 cups of food. I eat in about 5 minutes. Filling though. Number two is that it looks like vegetables, with a little bit of chicken in it. Most of the dishes look green though.

This perception that we eat a steak floating in butter ( delicious ), is our daily food is what has made people think low carb is unhealthy. We can have it, but in the long run, most of us end up with 8-16 ozs of meat, cooked in olive oil, with 8-12 servings of vegetables in a day. Then we add in eggs for breakfast, and nuts cheeses, and fruit to fill out our calories.

Others also use mayo, or avocado to up fat too. I just can't eat mayo ( soy ), and don't like avocados.


Edited by: RUSSELL_40 at: 5/26/2014 (08:32)
"We can't solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them "

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“Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.”

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5/25/14 10:16 P
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I've not found it too hard to get plenty of fats. I cook up my veggies in olive oil, or coconut oil and I add plenty. I also put full fat blue cheese dressing (home made of course) on my salads. The dressing takes a less than 100 calorie salad and turns it into a 400 calorie meal.

LITTLEWIND53's Photo LITTLEWIND53 Posts: 17,178
5/25/14 1:11 P

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A few years ago my (then) doc sent me to a nutritionist who gave me a diet of over 200 gm carbs per day. Well let me tell you that THAT almost put me in a coma. I was always falling asleep and often had high BS well above 30 (Canadian Measurement - about 550 to 600 US)

So I tried to go low carb. When I went back to my doc and told him what had happened, he was quite happy for me to go low carb and high protein. But I started having some kidney problems so had to cut back on the protein.

My problem is trying to get enough fat to make up the difference. I have never liked many fats. I do like cheddar cheese, some (but not all) nuts, I use full fat milk (3 1/2 percent is the most that is available here) And I use full fat salad dressings (I buy Kraft because I have never found any recipes for home made that I like) The low fat kind really tastes WEIRD to me...... I refuse to eat chicken skin or fat from a roast or steak (I shudder at the taste!) I don't eat yogurt or sour cream or any of the stuff that is reported to be "good for you" because I can't stand the taste of most of it. I have a lot of allergies so, as a result, am and always have been a very picky eater......

Of course, the stuff I used to eat had a LOT of fat because I was trying to avoid sugar. And let's face it, high fat food tastes great to most people.

My A1C is slowly coming down but still could be better. So my question, what do you eat to keep you fat consumption up?

Linda

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5/25/14 10:07 A
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The fact that the "norm" was not low carb would not be so bad if low carb were not so vilified that people were afraid to try it. Even so, most type 2 diabetics really should start with reducing carbs far below the current recommendations.

The other thing that people should probably hear more about is that low carb does not have to mean a plate full of meat and cheese. Someone looking at what I eat would say I eat veggies and little else. However, when you break it down by carb/protein/fat you would see that I'm around 70% fat and then around 15% carb (mostly non starchy) and 15% protein. I'm eating far more veggies and a far better balanced diet than I ever did while following the "healthy" guidelines that were pushed at us from all directions.

1CRAZYDOG's Photo 1CRAZYDOG Posts: 428,901
5/25/14 9:32 A

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You know, you're right. It's the NORM that needs to change! I guess as I am who I am, I take everything with a grain of questioning, so if my Dr. tells me something that doesn't make sense, or I know hasn't worked for me, I am used to speaking up. And thank goodness my Dr. will listen!

Thanks for your insight! It's refreshing.

Love is the root of all things good in life.


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RUSSELL_40's Photo RUSSELL_40 Posts: 16,826
5/25/14 9:17 A

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I think it would be much better for diabetics if we didn't " buck the norm ", but that the norm changed to something that had a better success rate. While it is fine that low carb worked for me, others are going to trust their doctors, so until the norm changes, people will continue eating the " diabetic " diet.

I think patients need to believe that their doctors can fix their problems, and while I believe low carb is far superior in treating diabetes, it would be better if that came through their doctor.. both because it would improve the doctor/patient relationship, and because you shouldn't be taking advice from someone on the internet.

My doctor preached the diabetic diet for 7 years, and when I was about to be put on Insulin, I instead started low carb. My doctor had told me Insulin wasn't that bad, and I would have even better control, and gave me 6 months to " follow my diet better ". However, he said, if I didn't show any improvement, then I should be on Insulin, since the pills weren't working.

When I showed up at 6 months, with tales of low blood sugars, and a 6.2 A1C, he was happy for me, and even cut my pills in half. Then at 1 year, my A1C was 5.7, and he cut me off all my pills. At that point I told him I had been on low carb for a year, and that was what was working. He warned me of all the danger.

How do you think I feel about my doctor. At the very least, I think he has no plan to help me as a diabetic. His plan failed me for 7 years, and low carb worked in 1. At worst, I think he is a moron, and now doubt him whenever I have a health issue. That isn't a good thing. Of course, they all think a " diabetic " diet is the fix, so it isn't like I could find another doctor who had a different approach, so we just kind of don't talk about my diet, and my A1C is now 5.0.

Patients are going to do what their doctors tell them to do, so what I want to change is the advice handed out. I want diabetics to ask why they aren't getting results, not quit doing what their doctors say to do, that way doctors have to change, so that all Type 2 diabetics can have stable, low blood sugars without meds, not just those who " buck the norm ".

I think that if most diabetics went and asked their doctor when the doctor expected them to be off their diabetes meds, the answer would be NEVER. That should worry them.



"We can't solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them "

- Albert Einstein

“Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.”

- Henry Ford


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1CRAZYDOG's Photo 1CRAZYDOG Posts: 428,901
5/24/14 7:55 P

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Thank you for your information, Russell! WE really do have to figure out what works fr us. For sure. And if it bucks "the norms", so be it!

Love is the root of all things good in life.


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RUSSELL_40's Photo RUSSELL_40 Posts: 16,826
5/24/14 6:27 P

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I have to disagree with this idea of moderation. You know what we are ALSo getting in moderation? Decent health.

Fat is good for you. Not a little. It is better than carbs for you, so you should be eating more fat, which does not spike your blood sugars, than carbs, which make them soar. We are always going to eat a little bit of carbs, and this should be mostly from veggies, but while we do need fat to metabolize carbs, we do not need carbs to metabolize fat. You can do fine on NO carb, if you can stand it.

I eat around 65% fat, 12 % carbs, and have lost 180 lbs, and got off my diabetes medications within 1 years of starting, maintained for 4 years, and have a 5.0 A1C. If I ate in moderation, my A1C would still be 6.5-7.0, while on medication.

You are taking pills to counteract the high blood sugars from eating moderate amounts of carbs. By simply removing most of the carbs, you don't need pills, and don't have high blood sugars.

If something works, why do it in moderation? That makes no sense. It is this lingering idea that fat is said to be good for you now... but let's hedge our bets, and go halfway.

You know what is bad for you.. carbs. Not ALL carbs, but most of what we eat is why we have an obesity epidemic, and ever-increasing diabetics, as well as younger diabetics.

If you eat carbs ( even complex ones ), and they turn immediately into glucose, and spike your blood sugar, requiring medication, what is GOOD about them. Why would anyone who is diabetic consume them? You are basically taking pills because the carbs are unhealthy for you, but you don't want to give them up.. so you eat carbs in moderation, and take pills in moderation, and have decent health .. in moderation.

Later on you will have kidney dialysis in moderation, and blindness in moderation, and amputation in moderation.. but I guess that is awesome., since moderation is so good.

Your goal should be to eat just enough carbs to avoid low blood sugars, and keep them at 80-110 without pills. It is possible, as long as we are willing to look at what spikes our blood sugars, and ask, why are we eating the very foods that makes us fat, and sick, instead of eating fat, which keeps blood sugars low, and makes us healthier? Yes, even saturated fat. I eat eggs, chicken, and butter daily, and have low cholesterol, and my HDL is up, despite consuming over 1000 mg a day of dietary cholesterol. This isn't a suggestion that you do the same, but just to point out how wrong they are.

Moderation is how they came up with the diabetic diet.. you dropped from 60 % carbs to 45 %, and your blood sugars improved. That is because carbs are the cause of high blood sugars/diabetes. Drop to 30 %, and they will drop even lower. At 15 % carbs, you will probably have low, stable blood sugars without meds, and no cravings.

I love the idea that a 15 % drop in carb helps diabetes, but no one thinks dropping it another 15 % would be beneficial. Sadly, I followed this idea for 7 years myself, with disastrous results, so I understand the reluctance to do something different, but if the diabetic diet worked, we would see less diabetics, not more.

The real diabetic diet is low carb. One that actually gets you the results that you started the diabetic diet for. I hope one day, we treat all diabetics with low carb, and we can eradicate type 2 diabetes completely. It is 100 % diet related, and can be reversed. Sadly, until doctors accept it, most patients will continue to eat food that spikes their blood sugars, and then wonder why it is high, and why they need meds. Many will die before they finally admit that 45 % carbs is way too high, because change is slow.

The only good news is that there is some change. There are so many diabetics who now have stable blood sugars without meds, that they are spreading the word around, and I see this almost daily now, but it is so frustrating to hear people saying we should just eat a little less of what is making us sick. How about we let results decide what is healthy. Cut carbs till you have an 80 fbs , without meds. That is the level that is healthy for you.

"We can't solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them "

- Albert Einstein

“Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.”

- Henry Ford


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1CRAZYDOG's Photo 1CRAZYDOG Posts: 428,901
5/23/14 12:55 P

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Yes to both of you! Carbs and proteins should be taken together and they should be ROUGHLY proportional. And there has to be good fat in the diet too (like coconut oil, extra virgin olive oil . . . not overdone . . . a little!) so that the carbs are metabolized.

It really seems counter-intuitive, but it makes sense!

Love is the root of all things good in life.


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SWEETISHA1's Photo SWEETISHA1 Posts: 668
5/23/14 10:34 A

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I have been eating pure butter an full milk now for more than a month and my bs is alredy getting lower but still not stable but i dont have a routine yet.. but i do feel more happy inside my body, i also take on occasion 1 tiny tsp of cane br. cane-sugar in a large cup of cafe au lait with full milk, home made which keeps me from drinking too much coffee as a coffee addict...
I put a blob of butter on my veges and i have not put on weight since i slowly started this change but none has come off yet, i want to take it slow..
I have difficulty eating beef as in steak but i can eat beef cooked for a few hours and lamb , mutton, and a soft form of bacon.. so its still early days but i do like how my body feels...
I also sometimes buy cream and put that on porridge in the morning, but i dont eat the same everyday..
Still not off med's as yet but i'm optimistic...
Tisha

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GLIOWIENRAYNA's Photo GLIOWIENRAYNA Posts: 68
5/23/14 9:46 A

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Since making the switch from all low-fat, artificial foods, to moderate amounts of REAL food, like butter instead of margarine, whole milk in place of skim, etc....my cholesterol has improved down to normal levels, and my sugar is much easier to regulate.

I do also use coconut oil for cooking in place of other fats about 75% of the time, so I'm not cooking in butter every day by any means.

I've also found (on the advice from a 75 year old diabetic) that if I have just the smallest of servings of some kind carb with a bit of sugar at bedtime, I'm no longer struggling with Dawn Phenomenon. I take one strawberry, dip it in sour cream, dip the end of it dark brown sugar and that's my bedtime nosh with my bedtime Rx.

Since doing that my morning sugars have gone from an average of 130 in the mornings, to 85. It's awesome.

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1CRAZYDOG's Photo 1CRAZYDOG Posts: 428,901
5/23/14 7:50 A

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I cannot remember who his guest was on that segment, but I am pretty sure it was another cardiac surgeon!

He does tend to tout a lot of supplements, and frankly, if I got all the recommended supplements I'd have an addition to keep 'em all in.

I think he is leaning more towards food = medicine, which makes me happy, as that's my philosophy . . . not pills.

Love is the root of all things good in life.


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5/23/14 7:22 A
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Wow, I'm going to have to re-think my opinion of Dr. Oz. In the past, he was blindly pushing the low fat line so much that I wrote him off as a quack.

1CRAZYDOG's Photo 1CRAZYDOG Posts: 428,901
5/23/14 7:15 A

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This is all very interesting! I have to say, I was totally shocked the other day watching Dr. Oz -- a cardiac surgeon talking about some of this information!

He even touted the use of 1 Tbsp. of butter in your coffee vs. sugar and cream! Said it keeps you fuller longer. Fats DO that for sure.

Secondly, he also talked about the fact that fat in relation to cholesterol DOES get a bad rap! It HAS a place in the diet.

The reason it makes sense to me is that the body DOES need fat in order to metabolize carbs. That's how our bodies were designed! So, carbs are not evil.

I DO believe, however, that we have to exercise moderation in our food choices, no matter WHAT nutrition plan we follow! That's the key. And eating in appropriate portions.

I had to chuckle that eating full on fat ice cream is healthier than the alternative. Don't think I'm going to be doing that, but just found it interesting.

Oh, and Dr. Oz DID mention that it appears that full fat milk is healthier than skim. emoticon Lots to think about!

Love is the root of all things good in life.


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FOXSTAR10's Photo FOXSTAR10 SparkPoints: (81,957)
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5/23/14 5:05 A

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