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BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
9/12/12 10:59 A

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Absolutely shirley..if there ha been anything to criticize about Obama's family values, the GOP would have rubbed their hands in glee and jumped on it!

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9/12/12 9:14 A

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Bridie5 you are certainly right about the no ethics thing.Actually Obama is one of very few politicians who seems to realize what commitment to a wife means. emoticon

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CEELEE53's Photo CEELEE53 Posts: 4,785
9/11/12 10:20 P

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Bridie..."I doubt I would have made a big deal about whether the GOP included God and Israel in their platform either. The Campaign is political. The issue at hand is government."

ITA!

"My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But now (or 'as it is') my kingdom is not from the world" (John 18:36) And yet, in this country, "christians" want to run the government and change the laws to reflect their viewpoints.

"Let us never forget that government is ourselves and not an alien power over us. The ultimate rulers of our democracy are not a President and senators and congressmen and government officials, but the voters of this country."
Franklin D. Roosevelt



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BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
9/9/12 5:57 A

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My own concern would be more for ethics..and few have those today either..

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9/8/12 9:56 A

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While politics and religion must be seperate in the USA (and I wouldn't want it any other way) we who are religious want to think our representatives are also.Even though few are.Humans are odd creatures. emoticon

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BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
9/8/12 8:04 A

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I doubt I would have made a big deal about whether the GOP included God and Israel in their platform either. The Campaign is political. The issue at hand is government.

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CD833620 Posts: 42,077
9/8/12 6:57 A

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I was too Ally, but then I remember it is all about votes. They were catering for the religious people that does not understand that religion should not be mixed with politics (and those numbers in America are really high).
Booing is extremely childish. The only place I think booing is OK is rock concerts.


COACHPENNY's Photo COACHPENNY Posts: 10,392
9/7/12 10:36 P

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I actually feel that way about you making such a big deal about this issue. It's amusing.



“A word to the wise ain't necessary, it's the stupid ones who need the advice.”

Bill Cosby


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ALLYINTEXAS's Photo ALLYINTEXAS Posts: 3,463
9/7/12 10:33 P

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The DNC vote required a 2/3 vote. The vote occurred at a time of day when not all delegates were present. In fact, if you rewatch the tape of the vote, you'll see a LOT of empty seats. Did the missing delegates know in advance a vote would be taken? A verbal vote has a lot of room for error and hard to clarify in a close such as the DNC vote vote. They had to vote 3 times and still everyone on stage looked concerned, awkward, and usnure. The change only came after GOP jumped on the omission. Of course news reports say O wanted it back in; he's running for office and can't alienate the moderate undecided voters.

abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/
democrats
-rapidly-revise-platform-incl
ude-g
od/story?id=17164108#.UEqdvc27Pjg


I find it amusing that people shrug if off as no big deal given that the debacle happened at the DNC. It would have been quite the 'separation of church and state' uproar had it happened at the GOP convention.


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COACHPENNY's Photo COACHPENNY Posts: 10,392
9/7/12 8:37 P

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It wouldn't occur to you that there are individual beliefs?



“A word to the wise ain't necessary, it's the stupid ones who need the advice.”

Bill Cosby


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ALLYINTEXAS's Photo ALLYINTEXAS Posts: 3,463
9/7/12 8:06 P

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I was surprised to see the many references to God in speeches throughout the convention. Not because I don't believe a person can be both D and Christian, or D and another faith that believes in God or a god, but because of the emphasis on separation of church and state.

The big to do about the exclusion/inclusion was the reaction of the DNC participants. Very few voted to amend; quite a few voted against. And there was a loud Boo upon hearing the results.

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BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
9/6/12 5:16 P

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I know Willam..that's sad but true..

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COACHPENNY's Photo COACHPENNY Posts: 10,392
9/6/12 4:55 P

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I did not and do not attach such drama to the omission of God and Jerusalem in the Democratic platform. It was omitted, it was corrected. I simply don't care that conservs were having conniptions over this. Is it important, politically?...yes. Did the omission prove that Democrats are heathens and have no commitment to Jerusalem?...NO.

President Obama specifically asked for the platform to be corrected.

www.sfgate.com/business/bloomberg/ar
ti
cle/Obama-Changes-Platform-to-Back-JR>erusalem-as-3844601.phpresient


Are there concerns by some that Israel does not treat the Palestinians fairly?...yes.



Edited by: COACHPENNY at: 9/6/2012 (16:59)


“A word to the wise ain't necessary, it's the stupid ones who need the advice.”

Bill Cosby


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CD833620 Posts: 42,077
9/6/12 4:45 P

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SO Shirley, you made a deal with God? Catholics do that a lot.
Bridie, Israel will never find peace with its neighbors as long as they keep adding to the Israel territory and treat Palestinians as inferiors.
Jerusalem the capital of Israel? Highly questionable.


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9/6/12 2:42 P

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While I took the chance I was told I would probably die and the baby would for sure.I WOULD HAVE RATHER HAVE DIED THAN LIVE CHILDLESS.I DID NOT consider myself a christian but I still prayed to God and meant it as they wheeled me into the delivery room a very specefic prayer.God I can't endure going home childless again.If this baby dies Please I beg you take me too.IF you let he and I live I'll do my best to raise him to be a Christian.Short end he lived and I had 2 after.God answered my prayer and I kept my promise.I was 20 then now 77 and even though overweight the docs find me healthy.Year after year.I however don't expect anyone else to risk their life unless they are willing to.Even in my day and age there were places where you could get sneak abortions. emoticon

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BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
9/6/12 12:59 P

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With you on Sr. Simone's speech. My faith also supports social justice, and explains a lot of my views. Not being a conservative doesn't mean one has no spiritual beliefs. I feel religion has no place in government however, and that our main concern with Israel should be that we continue to have a friendly base in the middle east. I probably would have left both things out, but realize they are an issue with voters who feel those things would be a wrongful omission. . Myself? I feel that Israel needs to work out their differences with their neighbors diplomaticlly, and have no desire to go to war with them should they involve themselves with Iran.

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CD839573 Posts: 3,285
9/6/12 12:46 P

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I agree with William that both the God and Jerusalem things in the platform are mistakes and putting them back in was a purely political move. They don't want to give the impression (and give power to the conservative assumption) that Democrats are faithless, athiest, heathens. I don't have any problem however with people talking about their faith. My faith, just as many conservatives' faiths, helps guide how I feel about many political issues. I'm sure that's the same for many in all areas of the political spectrum. Part of my faith supports social justice, which is partly why I stand where I stand on immigration and reproductive rights and marriage equality.

I do have to say that being a Catholic school girl, I spent a lot of time with some awesome nuns and I adored Sister Simone Campbell's speech.

CD833620 Posts: 42,077
9/6/12 10:49 A

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I think that both are mistakes, but I do know this does not come as a surprise for you guys.

Popeye, I do not know about penny, but I do not care about either of them. I do not see how “God” mixes with politics, but Hey, in America religion is everywhere.

And you are right in your assessment, if the “God” thing was not put back, votes would be lost. And I do think that is why it was put back.

Shirley, I think it is really curious exceptions regarding abortion. But I do like black and white situations. If abortions is “murder” it will be murder no matter what. If in case of risk for the mother’s life it is OK, it should be OK anyway.



BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
9/6/12 9:22 A

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Since abortion is legal, and Obama's stand on abortion is that each woman has the right to choose what is best for herself and her own family instead of allowing strangers or the government to choose, I find nothing to quarrel with. If one doesn't believe in them, no law says you have to have one or encourage your friends and loved ones to do so. Conversely, no law gives you the right to decide that other women can't.

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SHIRLEY721's Photo SHIRLEY721 SparkPoints: (0)
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9/6/12 8:27 A

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Whoops Ally,sorry I can't believe I forgot that one since it's the one thing I am so strongly against that I actually took part in a demonstration against it at one time.So I guess it's 90% not 100.I am afraid abortion is here to stay much as I hate it.I do make one exception say the woman's life is in danger. emoticon

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COACHPENNY's Photo COACHPENNY Posts: 10,392
9/6/12 5:29 A

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LOL pops.

“Not everything that is faced can be changed, but nothing can be changed until it is faced.”
― James Baldwin

Edited by: COACHPENNY at: 9/6/2012 (05:30)


“A word to the wise ain't necessary, it's the stupid ones who need the advice.”

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ALLYINTEXAS's Photo ALLYINTEXAS Posts: 3,463
9/6/12 12:30 A

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Pops, it was an interesting vote; not many people voted in the first vote of whether to make a change or not. Then they had to do 'do overs' three times to make a decision. It was awkward and didn't seem to be a true 'fair' vote.


Shirley, I thought you opposed O's position on abortion; did that change? Just curious since you said you're now 100% happy. I found his statement in 2008 disappointing/troubling; if his 'daughters make a mistake, he doesn't want them punished with a baby." www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBJry
E6nUVM




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POPEYETHETURTLE's Photo POPEYETHETURTLE SparkPoints: (0)
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9/5/12 11:30 P

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I didn't think the DNC would be able to slip this "no God" references and ignore the capital of Israel as Jerusalem through, but I was waiting for the convention to close before bringing it up.

It appears the progressive liberals still lack the 2/3 majority to dump God from their platform. They would have lost a number of minority voters if they had done that. Rats!

CoachPenny, you are so predictable lately. You don't care if God was removed from the Democratic platform - or you just don't care that your political opponents are watching so diligently?

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COACHPENNY's Photo COACHPENNY Posts: 10,392
9/5/12 9:57 P

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You obviously care Ally...I don't.



“A word to the wise ain't necessary, it's the stupid ones who need the advice.”

Bill Cosby


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SHIRLEY721's Photo SHIRLEY721 SparkPoints: (0)
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9/5/12 8:42 P

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They want votes.They are politicians that is all. emoticon

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ALLYINTEXAS's Photo ALLYINTEXAS Posts: 3,463
9/5/12 8:23 P

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Shirley, when the convention opened yesterday, "God given" and "Jerusalem" were omitted; they were voted back in today by the delegates (if you watched the video link below, it was an interesting "let's try this again" democratic vote and a lot of delegates BOOd). You have to wonder who took the lead to remove and approve their removal and who took the lead to add it back in? And why they look so wishy-washy.



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9/5/12 8:04 P

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That was the only thing I was upset with Obama about.Now I'm 100% happy.Jurusalem has always been the capital according to God. emoticon

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ALLYINTEXAS's Photo ALLYINTEXAS Posts: 3,463
9/5/12 7:49 P

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I noticed quite a few references to God last night during the DNC speeches.

At times, I felt the GOP and DNC sounded pretty similar; not just on the faith issues.

But things are getting more interesting with today's vote on God and Jerusalem ...

www.youtube.com/watch?feature
=player_e
mbedded&v=cncbOEoQbOg



What's your take on the vote and the addendum changes voted in today?



Edited by: ALLYINTEXAS at: 9/5/2012 (19:52)
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