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7/24/18 9:46 P

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GBOMBS ….. That one I am familiar with. Now I will delve into the other Doctors mentioned.

Leader "SLIGHTLY OFF THE WALL TEAM".

Leader "SMALL GOALS and COMMITMENT TEAM."
....................................
-Kind words can be short and easy to speak but their echoes are truly endless. -Mother Teresa-
-Success is the sum of small efforts repeated day in and day out.-
-When you fail to plan, you plan to fail.




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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
7/20/18 9:16 A

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I pulled this out again. It is very helpful!

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
6/25/18 10:03 A

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I also want to pick this thread up again.
As well as Dr. Greger's book - I want to find his daily checklist and see about doing that

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
5/21/18 11:43 A

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emoticon emoticon emoticon emoticon emoticon emoticon emoticon emoticon emoticon emoticon emoticon

Edited by: ZIPITUP at: 5/24/2018 (18:47)
~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
5/21/18 10:13 A

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GBOMBS



Edited by: ZIPITUP at: 5/24/2018 (18:48)
~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
5/21/18 9:57 A

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Hi

Edited by: ZIPITUP at: 5/24/2018 (18:46)
~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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WHITE-2's Photo WHITE-2 Posts: 369
5/17/18 7:22 A

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I regret getting the e-book, I should have gotten a paperback... I like it so much better.

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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
5/14/18 10:58 A

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I've been so busy reading library books I have not picked up End of Dieting..need to go dust it off!

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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WHITE-2's Photo WHITE-2 Posts: 369
4/19/18 4:09 P

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I totally understand about the birthday cake. I felt the same way when I celebrated my own birthday with my parents a while ago.

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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
4/19/18 3:33 P

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Yes! I think the whole body gets healthier and it is not just about fat loss. Cellular healing....gotta have Fr. F. sing that to the tune of the Marvin Gaye song.

and yes- well about keto I think for some it can actually be a step in the right direction.
Some folks think being vegan is about vegan french toast...meat analogs...
Ya know it is funny but I am always seeing keto "bread" recipes and protein recipes.
I don't really understand why? If I did that diet I would just eat greens and fat and some protein-

I think it is why those who try this but have dabbled in keto or tired it out can have interesting conversations because I am pretty sure that eat to Live is supposed to put you on the path of unprocessed foods.

I am on day 3 of the E2l 6 week challenge in order to get back on track. It is such good food!
My Dad's 91st birthday is today- he is at a nursing home and they make these little cakes - cute..but of course sooooo highly processed. I had about 2T of it- a small slice. It made my Dad happy to share and and sure I could have spit in my napkin when no one was looking...lol
no biggie
Other than that all high density nutrition.

I bought some watercress yesterday and made a soup with onion and garlic and a sweet potato and 4T of hemp seeds and broth and yum! Threw it in blender and watercress last and simmered...some spices- all spices and a dash of herbamere...(so a bit of salt in that )


~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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WHITE-2's Photo WHITE-2 Posts: 369
4/19/18 2:17 P

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From Emily's transformation account: "The doctor noticed that my abdominal skin, after losing so much belly fat, retracted back to normal. He said he doesn’t typically observe that with patients who lose a lot of weight."

Wow, I hope that ETL made that difference. I am quite concerned (now and then) that if I should lose my extra weight I will have a lot of loose skin. It does not worry me enough to not try to lose weight but I do fear the way my skin will look. I wonder how old Emily was when she had her transformation...

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STARTING-ANEW's Photo STARTING-ANEW Posts: 1,180
4/18/18 7:48 P

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My son was doing the Keto diet...red flags....no fruits...not beans...no legumes....high fats...lots of meats.....no thanks..

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4/18/18 7:47 P

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I'm reading "The End of Dieting" right now...so full of practical advise....

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4/17/18 12:49 P

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It was inspirational to read again the detailed account of Emily’s transformation! Just what I need to get me back on track after a week cruising (bad eating).

Jonnie

EST

If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right.
~Henry Ford

Nothing tastes as good as skinny feels.
~Kate Moss


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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
4/17/18 8:35 A

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I'm still reading End of Dieting but also decided to jump back into a 6 week challenge and weigh after. Really stick to it...
I guess for me I just look at it as super fuel- temple of god /anything spiritual does not click for me.

and yes I think optimal for any age!

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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SOPHIALARA's Photo SOPHIALARA Posts: 952
4/10/18 12:28 A

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What a wonderful read! I just read through her transformation. Wow! I've read it before, but it was so good to read it again. I feel motivated and determined to succeed this time! Thank you for posting the link. I have it bookmarked so I can come back and re-read it over and over. I have all of Dr. Fuhrman's books, both of his 10 in 20 packages, and the one for heart health. I have so many resources and information. I just need to follow it.

I also love how Emily likened her body to a work of art, which I believe it truly is. "The temple of God." So lovely and worth transforming into the work of art it was meant to be, even at my age (I'll be 65 in June).




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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
4/9/18 8:09 A

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Thanks Lara,
I'm enjoying reviewing it. It is helping me.

I read Chapter 2 and want to discuss it..but I did go ahead and on page 92 of my copy the story of Emily....
She shares in End of Dieting that she kept trying the 6 week challenge on and off for 5 years!!!
and..she has a story of her transformation- you can see it here and click on transforamtion on left side.
www.emilyboller.com/
It is exciting story. Motivational.
and as with anything we want it is about the work...

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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SOPHIALARA's Photo SOPHIALARA Posts: 952
4/8/18 12:56 A

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This is a great topic. Thank you for starting it. I've been trying and trying to stay with the
Nutritarian way of eating for a few years now. I'm good for a few days, then I go off of it for a few weeks. I'm finding that I either get obsessive with my food, or have a lackadaisical attitude. I really like the comments you made, Zipitup. Very insightful and helpful for me. There are a few others who posted that made much sense to me, also. Thank you! I'll be visiting this thread again. ~Lara




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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
4/7/18 8:24 A

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A wonderful thing about eating this way is that counting macro nutrients is not necessary.
Counting carbs or protein or fat is not part of it- just eating to get the micronutrients.

So- knowing that the salad/fresh veggies and the cooked veggies are important and unless a person is exercising a tremendous amount that say a bowl of brown rice or quinoa would be limited to a cup...so there is that aspect of watchfulness of it.

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
4/6/18 11:10 A

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I read chapter 1.
About-Toxic hunger+ food addiction

Years ago when I had heard about Fuhrman the part of me that romanticizes about food thought this way of eating would only work for some one who is..well robot like.

Looking at food as fuel. H=N/C

And did not think it was for me- not because I liked junk food but considered myself a foodie so how could I do without a roasted lamb marinated overnight cooked with fresh rosemary ..paired with wine.. and fresh asparagus.
-In his non vegan version you can have the lamb but much much less.

I agree with the food as fuel more now after having run a marathon last year and seeing that high density nutrition supported training and recovery after running and races.

I think chapter 1 is good info for those using the "window diet"...do you want fries with that??

About protein-
Ultramarathoner Rich Roll does not concern himself with protein.
And has had Dr. Garth Davis on his show:
www.richroll.com/podcast/our-misplac
ed
-obsession-with-protein-garth-davis-R>md-on-high-fat-low-carb-diets-bad-sc
ie
nce-how-to-separate-nutritional-
fact-f
rom-popular-fiction/

And here is another podcast about that subject.
www.mattprindle.com/animal-plant-pro
te
in/

Enlightening.
I eat enough calories= I get enough protein...and I don't burden my kidneys..

And another thing to say about food addicition - Dr. Alan Goldhamer has said that the food you eat today is the food you will crave tomorrow.

I know if we do that eat foods that are high density nutrition thart we can retrain our taste buds and brain..which kinda brings me back to the robot thing.. and I would say.. I do wonder if Dr. Goldhamer is human emoticon
He doea have much info and he has a dry sense of humor www.youtube.com/user/TrueNorthHealth
12
3


So for me in the day to day and what I hav t watch for- my DD had a birthday and I out 2 chocolate bars in a bag along with some toehr things..milk chocolate and the sang their siren song..and I ate and then replaced...now I guess Goldhamer would say if I am buying it for my DD do I even love her! I just think it is extreme..BUT maybe not..
anyhow-
I will read Chapter 2 soon..and I am going forth this Saturday with eating with the concept of food as fuel. As another sort of experiment. To not fall into the pleasure trap- to avoid it.

I am using my race as a reason and also as a way to negotiate with my brain who still wants the chocolate and the bacon.. and the butter... and the white bread/pizza/pancakes.. the beer as a way to say ..oh it is only for now...
shhhhh it might be longer emoticon

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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-JAMES-'s Photo -JAMES- Posts: 11,637
4/5/18 2:25 P

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It's like I'm speed reading. It will slow down.

My thoughts on "Chapter 1".

I agree the food pyramid is not right. Base of the pyramid is:
- bread, cereal, rice, pasta

These are the things most devoid of nutrients, and for me things which hit my blood sugar the worst. I agree with the compulsive eating issue, though I think that there is a very physical component to that, and it is blood sugar. You eat refined carbohydrates, your blood sugar goes up, insulin brings blood sugar down, but by storing it away into mostly body fat. Your blood sugar goes down, and the solution ... eat carbs to raise your blood sugar ... vicious cycle.

Right after the early mention of the food pyramid he mentions foods low in nutrients:
- white bread
- oils
- chicken



I just had a look at protein from a grams of protein per calorie view (HEALTH = NUTRITENTS / CALORIES) and see how chicken rates. To my surprise it looks like this in grams of protein per calorie:

- chicken (0.19 grams/calorie)
- peas ( 0.07)
- kale (0.07)
- boccoli (0.09)
- mushrooms (0.14 )

Mushrooms are surprisingly high in protein!!

I agree that to be successful it shouldn't be a temporary diet, it should be a consistent way of eating.

I agree that manufactured foods are, ... well over flavoured, over processed, etc. I myself focus on real food, and yes the flavours are a lot subtler.

Other than a few jabs at meat, I'm OK with chapter 1.

I'm not "high protein", I'm just enough protein. I won't reveal a daily number of grams of protein, but if someone else does I'd be happy to hear it.

Edited by: -JAMES- at: 4/5/2018 (19:27)
James


All time highest weight : 217 pounds

Starting weight : 195.0 pounds (June 7, 2012)
Final weight : 168.2 pounds (July 23, 2013)


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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
4/5/18 12:06 P

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James- I appreciate your input.

I am a just the facts kind of person and so I appreciate Dr. Fuhrman and also Dr. Greger who studies the studies to try to get to the truth..

I think your wife is right- that is why it has been said that there are undernourished obese people.

Also- I like having discussions with people who have differing points of view as it creates more opportunities to learn. Keto did not work for me. I am glad I tried it.

Every once in awhile when I get frustrated I think about doing it again as it works for weight loss...the odd thing for me anyway is I ask myself am I healthy enough to deal with keto?

Brain fog , constipation and low energy were side effects of it (for me) BUT I was almost into the 130's - the weight was going...but I did not even feel like eating. Sometimes just felt kind of a nausea..and then heart palpitations and a weird throbbing in the gallbladder area ended the experiment!

(so my wanting to try to do keto again is coming from frustration and not facts)

And yep- no perfect food ...I have heard jokes about kale being wonderful but having it as the only food would not at all be healthy! emoticon

IMO a keto diet with vegetables is far healthier than a SAD diet for ex- breakfast-skim milk and cereal such as special K..and then lunch-a bologna sandwich and supper-cheese pizza and a couple of beers ...that kind of diet equals inflammation.leading to disease...and no nutrients.

But to be honest? Do I think keto is healthy ? No. I don't. Saturated fat and too much protein.
So not for the long term ...although if someone is just going to go back to eating junk? I don't know-
I wish they would not eat the junk.

On SP I hear people following things like Grain Brain or Gundry's no lectins and they say it works- if they are eating more veggies and limiting bad foods..well it probably is...and of course losing weight will help some one on the path to health but I don't think it is sustainable and yes... I am talking not just people but our planet too. emoticon emoticon emoticon

I don't think there is one true diet as allergies exist..so if you hav e anut allergy then it is off the table .

I am open minded to a point just not so much my brains will fall out emoticon

Having said all of this though- I a having trouble breaking some addictions.. milk chocolate for ex and some chips- I use the excuse about a family crisis - it is bad but I realize to be able to handle all of it the best thing I can do is to eat healthy and have healthy routines.

So- that is the focus. I decided to let the scale go for a bit ..weighing in Saturday and then not for awhile..

I need to go read chapter 1!
Thank you for posting James- I really appreciate it!

Edited by: ZIPITUP at: 4/5/2018 (12:39)
~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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-JAMES-'s Photo -JAMES- Posts: 11,637
4/5/18 11:38 A

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OK, I'm a Keto person, I'm just putting that out straight away, so you know what direction I'm coming from.

I have had a copy of "The End of Dieting" on my shelf for a while. Now, thanks to WHITE-2 I'm motivated to read it. I'm a terrible reader, so I'm going to post comments chapter by chapter.

So, the very first section "Introduction".

I agree virtually 100%. I love Fuhrman's equation HEALTH = NUTRITENTS / CALORIES, which I've used very literally in the past. As a type-2 diabetic I want to avoid sugar and "empty" calories, and his equation hit the nail on the head to define "empty", that is none to very low on nutrition. There are so many nutrients that you have to look at them one at a time, and there is no one perfect food.

But when I did the math on vitamin C (a while ago) I googled foods high in vitamin C, then did the math, and bell peppers rated about the best:
nutritiondata.self.com/facts/
vegetable
s-and-vegetable-products/2536/2


- green pepper ( 4.0 mg/cal)
- orange (1.1 mg/cal)

So I eat green peppers in my salads. Keto for me isn't all about meat and fat, I eat a lot of plant foods too. The fact that green peppers pack over 3 times the vitamin C per calorie guides me to eat green peppers, and avoid oranges.

I could avoid oranges because they are high in sugar, and sugar is bad for diabetics, but I actually shifted my view due to Fuhrman, now rather than avoiding foods high in carbohydrates, I look for foods high in nutrients (and also lower in calories).

I have a Ph.D. in physics, so I am an equation and numbers guy. I've also had massage, and sometimes acupuncture, so I'm open to things.

My wife has the theory that potato chips are "addictive" because people keep hoping to find nutrition in the next one, but never find it, and when you eat foods with nutrition, you are happy and stop.

So I'm totally on board with everything in the introduction, except perhaps his avoidance of meat. I'm going to look at meat from amount of protein per calorie consumed point of view later.

But now on to chapter 1.

Edited by: -JAMES- at: 4/5/2018 (11:51)
James


All time highest weight : 217 pounds

Starting weight : 195.0 pounds (June 7, 2012)
Final weight : 168.2 pounds (July 23, 2013)


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WHITE-2's Photo WHITE-2 Posts: 369
4/5/18 2:58 A

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Good luck! How are you doing so far?

I have been reading parts of The End of Dieting now, going back and forth. Having a Kindle edition makes reading a bit harder because I can't just page through the book.

What struck me is that he altered his advice for the Life Plan: instead of eating 10 % of calories in animal / 'off limits' foods, he now says to have no more than 5 %.

Edited by: WHITE-2 at: 4/5/2018 (02:59)
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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
4/3/18 7:45 A

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It is amazing.
I'm finally in today.. it has been serioulsy chaotic and some very dificult things going on - but one thing I love is the 2-3 meals a day. I don't think about snacks but if I need one I go to water first and then a piece of fruit...and I have actually heard people say they get hungry after they eat an apple-as you said people are used to tha tfeeling of fullnes I guess..

-so- Breakfast I plan on veggies
Lunch- a HUGE salad
Supper I might have a green smoothie.

I'm going to try switching around what I have for breakfast and have it at night- unless I just have a bowl of soup that has greens in it..

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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WHITE-2's Photo WHITE-2 Posts: 369
3/30/18 4:33 P

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I am just amazed by what I read in that 'look inside the book' part and... it made me long to get the book, so I now got the kindle edition. Hope to start reading in the next few days.

The bit that struck me most was the following (I tried to word it for a friend, copying it, for convenience)...

"As I understood it Joel Fuhrman says that there are two phases to digestion.
Phase A is while you eat and the first hours after eating (I suppose when the stomach is still full, busy digesting). After that, Phase B starts, which is when the body starts a detoxification process. If phase B is active but you start eating again, B stops to make way for A.

Furhman states that people who have eaten a lot of nutrient-poor / junk food begin to feel somewhat ill / uncomfortable when phase B starts, they tend to want to get rid of it. So they either eat all day long OR they eat meals with a big amount of protein and fat because this means the food wills stay in the stomach longer, thus preventing phase B from happening.

He states that most people in the US are addicted to food that way: they keep eating all day or they eat too much protein and fat in order to not feel that unpleasant detox-phase B feeling. They think that what they feel during phase B is hunger when it's not and while their body does not need more calories.
This way, the body does not get enough of a chance to run phase B and detox, get rid of waste"

I recently hear a friend (who eats meat and fish) telling me that she feels unsatisfied after she goes to a vegan restaurant with her vegan friend. She says she needs to eat a lot of protein and fat to feel content. She spoke of 'light vegan fare'. I hear others who do low carb talk about having to eat a lot of fat and protein.
Since I have a slight kidney disfunction I can't eat a lot of protein, anyway but non-vegetarians just don't seem to get that... Everyone is so worried about protein....
Anyhow I just thought that that bit about the two phases might explain why my friends feel a need to have 'heavy' meals... No idea if it's true but it is (ha ha) 'food for thought'...

Edited by: WHITE-2 at: 3/30/2018 (16:37)
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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
3/29/18 5:20 P

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Ellen- I hope to see th e whole thing soon - it is long!

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
3/29/18 5:19 P

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Dr. Joel Funny guy- he is though!

~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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WHITE-2's Photo WHITE-2 Posts: 369
3/29/18 3:10 A

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Thank you. I started watching but I may just do 10 minutes per day or so.
I am laughing about his joke that Al-Qaida invented the SAD.

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ADAPTABLE_ELLEN's Photo ADAPTABLE_ELLEN Posts: 6,751
3/28/18 7:22 P

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Thanks for the info. I started watching, but have to stop to fix dinner. I will find time this weekend to finish it.

Remember, nobody can go back to the very beginning and make a brand new start, but anyone can start here and make a brand new end.

There's a difference between interest and commitment. When you're interested in doing something, you do it only when it's convenient. When you're committed to something, you accept no excuses; only results."

Ellen


 current weight: 134.8 
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ZIPITUP's Photo ZIPITUP Posts: 9,886
3/28/18 5:13 P

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Let us discuss! www.amazon.com/End-Dieting-How-Live-Life/d
p/0062249339


Edited by: ZIPITUP at: 5/24/2018 (18:54)
~Em~

“I always say that eating a plant based diet is the secret weapon of enhanced athletic performance.”
~ Rich Roll

"The thinnest people on the planet are those who eat the most carbohydrates." Dr. Neal Barnard

"What I say is that, if a man really likes potatoes, he must be a pretty decent sort of fellow."
~A.A. Milne


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