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NIGHTSTAR-71's Photo NIGHTSTAR-71 Posts: 159
8/2/18 12:16 P

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LADYSTARWIND
Good afternoon. IN NYC it is 12 pm
I really cannot get to the point what we discuss. It is no use to study level of sugar and meal without taking into consideration the level of insulin in blood, or how healthy pancreas is, or how many active Beta Cells available. It is not one line meal___________sugar. If pancreas is overactive and too much insulin secreted or injected, sugar in blood is low. If pancreas is too ill to secret insulin, or for some reason there is no storage available to store secreted insulin, then blood sugar is high. I am sorry for my spelling. I almost cannot see. I lost my glasses.
In present time there is only one problem with diabetes: we are too profitable for Med Pro and politics. every one care for diabetics. So, there are must be as many of us as politics and med pro need. Diabetes today is social issue. It can be perfectly treated with insulin injections. There is no Rx for insulin for diabetics type 2. No one even know what is it, diabetes type 2, but every one free to give advises how to deal with it.

LADYSTARWIND's Photo LADYSTARWIND Posts: 5,419
8/2/18 11:32 A

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Insulin "source" can be from your own pancreas or one of the many injectible ones (over 30 in production, both from animal sources or synthetically made)… and the injectibles are specifically made to have different half-lives....some last only a short time, some last more than 24 hrs.
www.diabetes-info.co.uk/treating-diabetes/
insulin-overview.html


Yes, C-peptide is the more stable breakdown product from insulin and the test of choice for an indication of insulin levels. Just as with many other lab test results, when looking at how much C peptide is present, many doctors look at the trend rather than a single result, and if any values are very low...or very high.
The same when testing for A1C. Both are indirect measures of how well your blood sugar is being controlled and far more useful than a "one point in time" Non-Fasting blood glucose measurement.

Interestingly, the major hospital (Univ of Washington, Seattle) where I worked does not do the C Peptide test on site any more... there were just not enough doctors ordering it. So when a doctor wants it, it is sent out to Mayo Clinic.

have a good day,
patti



Patti
"The only thing we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."
Gandalf: Lord of the Rings


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NIGHTSTAR-71's Photo NIGHTSTAR-71 Posts: 159
8/2/18 2:08 A

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LADYSTARWIND
What is the source for insulin?
Also why it is half time insulin from 4 to 20 hr? It is intractable insulin can be but insulin secreted by Beta cells does not have so long life. This is why insulin is too difficult to test. Usually in stead or insulin it is C Peptides, proteins tested. For diabetics type 2 it is "many" for DT1 it is "a few.". Very interesting count. My C peptide level is 2. Is this "many" or it is " a few'? I am diabetic type 2.
This is why I do not ask too many Q? I simple try to find answers in test books and another source.
Good night and best for you too,

LADYSTARWIND's Photo LADYSTARWIND Posts: 5,419
8/2/18 1:46 A

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Yes...there is always "some"insulin in the blood... because it lasts or has a half-life of 4-20 hours (depending on the source.) However, it is still released in response to an increase in blood sugar. This is part of a "feedback loop".


I suggest you talk with your doctor in the future and discuss some of this with them. All the best,
patti





Patti
"The only thing we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."
Gandalf: Lord of the Rings


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NIGHTSTAR-71's Photo NIGHTSTAR-71 Posts: 159
8/2/18 12:29 A

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LADYSTARWIND
I would not say that insulin is responsive for blood sugar. Insulin is all the time in blood. The same as some sugar. So, when we eat, it is meal that converted into glucose. Without insulin this process can go, yes. But brain function would be cut. Brain can function only with insulin and sugar and cannot use fat as source of energy.
So, insulin secretion never stops.When insulin secretion is slow then sugar rising abnormally. In study there are no numbers how sugar raised. It is natural process, and long time known. What is not known, how much insulin used for every calorie, or carb, or so so on.
All studies only to put responsibility to diabetic type 2. we eat, so this is why we are ill. So simple. Very often we compared with alcoholics and treatment for us is behavior therapy.
Do you know that cells do have special place to store insulin? If this space is empty and there is no insulin before our first bite we are so hungry that we cannot stop to eat. I do take shot of insulin when my sugar is low. It is odd, but works perfectly well. A small dose of insulin before meal, and there is no hunger. After meal I can take full dose of insulin, 240 units in the morning, and a little bit less before bed.

LADYSTARWIND's Photo LADYSTARWIND Posts: 5,419
8/1/18 10:56 P

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Nightstar… The technology they were using was "continuous glucose monitoring"... so they weren't actually drawing blood samples from these people. Without drawing many samples throughout the day--whenever the glucose spiked--, and then specially handling them, there was no way to measure the insulin. (Not easy to do in a study situation...the study person isn't always around a lab!!)

Insulin is also a "responsive" hormone: the glucose rises, and THEN the insulin is released. So following the glucose gives more information than seeing how high or low their insulin is.

Perhaps in another study they will look at insulin.
patti

Edited by: LADYSTARWIND at: 8/1/2018 (23:03)
Patti
"The only thing we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."
Gandalf: Lord of the Rings


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NIGHTSTAR-71's Photo NIGHTSTAR-71 Posts: 159
7/31/18 2:25 P

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-MEOW-- - 7
Level of sugar in blood depend on insulin secretion. So, to say that Insulin is not relevant is not correct.


--MEOW--'s Photo --MEOW-- Posts: 4,928
7/31/18 1:46 P

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That's because they weren't trying to find the universal food that causes glucose spikes. The article itself says that the same food had different effects on each person...

--"The individual responses to these meals were unique, suggesting that people metabolize the same nutrients in an individualized way."--

The only thing they were trying to prove was that high glucose spikes are normal even in healthy individuals ("healthy" in this particular article refers specifically to non-diabetics). Which is why insulin levels weren't considered. They found out that while these spikes are normal, they were much more common in some individuals, so what they want to know now is why...

--"The idea is to try to find out what makes someone a "spiker" and be able to give them actionable advice to shift them into the low glucotype"

"Our next study will delve into the physiological causes of glucose dysregulation" Snyder continued. "These include not only genetic variation, but also microbiome composition, and pancreas, liver, and digestive organ functions."--

So yes, in that "next study" they will probably take into consideration levels of insulin, but for this particular study, those levels weren't relevant.

- Danny :)
(CST)


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NIGHTSTAR-71's Photo NIGHTSTAR-71 Posts: 159
7/31/18 12:55 P

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Yes, there are meals counting and activity counting, but what about level of insulin in blood? This is not in study.
Without level of insulin in blood all studies how food effect glucose spicks are fake, nothing more m nothing less.What if there is no insulin in blood?

SHERYLDS's Photo SHERYLDS Posts: 17,766
7/31/18 12:26 P

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to be honest , I think most studies are a little flawed.
Healthy is a vague term these days.
For accuracy they would need a full genetic diagnostic and physical exam.
Unless they confine people and regulate exactly what they eat and monitor their activity level, it is hard to verify the results.

I guess that is why it seems like studies are repeated over and over... and sometimes coming up with a different analysis.

Sheryl, New Jersey EST, SUMMER 5% Challenge-KITCHEN CHAMPIONS


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NIGHTSTAR-71's Photo NIGHTSTAR-71 Posts: 159
7/31/18 5:32 A

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SHERYLDS
Thanks for link. I tried to do it, and I did it wrong.
Now about diet. Actually, it is not that diet healthy or not but people who were participants in studies were presented as they are "healthy" and in article there is nothing how "healthy" was determined.
You are right that one can think about diet it is 'healthy' when another think, myself for instance, that no one diet is really "healthy". Also it can be different criteria that one considered 'healthy' or not. So, these criteria must be put on and presented that those people whom study presented as "healthy" met that criteria.

SHERYLDS's Photo SHERYLDS Posts: 17,766
7/31/18 5:22 A

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this is way too technical for my little brain
What I do know is that what one person considers a healthy diet varies drastically from person to person. Someone who automatically reaches for foods which advertise 'made with whole grains' or 'organic' or 'natural' may think that automatically puts them into healthy foods...but if they add up the sugar a lot of these 'healthy foods' contribute to their sugar count they may think otherwise.

IMO...it isn't just the food someone eats, it is also the activity level and genetic makeup of a person that pre-disposes them to glucose level spikes in a healthy person. Even good genes can be negatively impacted by an unhealthy diet and/or inactive lifestyle.

Sheryl, New Jersey EST, SUMMER 5% Challenge-KITCHEN CHAMPIONS


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SHERYLDS's Photo SHERYLDS Posts: 17,766
7/31/18 5:07 A

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here is an easier link to the article
www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/07/1807
24174233.htm?utm_source=feedburner&utm
_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+sci
encedaily%2Fhealth_medicine%2Fdiabetes
+%28Diabetes+News+--+ScienceDaily%29


Sheryl, New Jersey EST, SUMMER 5% Challenge-KITCHEN CHAMPIONS


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NIGHTSTAR-71's Photo NIGHTSTAR-71 Posts: 159
7/31/18 1:46 A

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There is article and studies, I posted link to.
What do you think, is this really possible to find the universal food that glucose spikes would be avoided?
When I read this studies I just asked:
how it was diagnosed that participants of the study were "healthy people"?
My next question was,
why it is only food and level of glucose to study? Why there s no study at the same time, the level of insulin in blood?
And finally,
why glucose level checked out fasting when there is no carbs in blood? Of cause after eating there would be carbs and another meal, so sugar will rise.

"The idea is to try to find out what makes someone a "spiker" and be able to give them actionable advice to shift them into the low glucotype"
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/07/180724174233.htm?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+sciencedaily%2Fhealth_medicine%2Fdiabetes+%28Diabetes+News+--+ScienceDaily%29

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