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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
4/12/14 12:38 P

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HI Andi!

I gave up gluten in 2007. It was in April.
It wasn't all the difficult, bc it was causing me problems and I'd already limited it, since I hate how I felt after eating it.

The worst of it is when I go over to a friends to eat or to a restaurant.

At home its no problem at all, I simply don't bring "my poison" into the house.

As for actually healing the gut, I had issues for several years even after giving up the gluten, primarily bc I was going thru perimenopause then menopause. Not to mention thyroid disease.

I went for about 6 months doing the organic chicken bone broth route.
Currently I've made the commitment to eat at least 5 oz of leafy greens daily, either cooked or in a salad which has been working out nicely.

One of the things I have noticed is that I simply cannot eat any form of grains without suffering the consequences. I can maybe have one rice cake at a meal, but any more than that, I'm pushing it... here comes bloat!

Now I just pay attention to my body... which foods cause bloat.. those I avoid or eat less of.
I'm fine with all forms of dairy, all fruits and veggies, fish, poultry.
I'm not good with grains, processed/prepared foods, restaurant food.
I can eat them rarely, but daily, no.

Its all about changing your mindset towards food.
Learn to like what is good for your body... celebrate that you have found foods that support your health, rather than mourning the loss of those foods that were compromising it.

: )
Mzzchief

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4/9/14 11:55 P

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Thanks Mzz, I really appreciate that.

A few things. So my supps came in mail today including a liver detox my dr recommended. I looked at the ingredients and it has Vit B12 which I already have more than enough of. That concerned me.
Also, since you went thru this(Leaky Gut) just wondering how long did it take you to heal your gut? How do you know its healed? I know it will vary for each person.

MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
4/8/14 11:02 A

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Andi if I find anything else I will letcha know.
I really liked the idea of the faux graham cracker.
I also make almond macaroons that are delish, they recipe is buried in my blogs.


gotta get to class.

:)
Mzzchief

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4/8/14 12:46 A

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Wow, those look like some great recipes. I will definitely try some. Thanks for thinking of me and sending the link....it gives me hope :)

MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
4/7/14 10:33 P

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HI Andi

I thought of you when I was reading this blog.
Its got some recipes and food ideas you may be interested in looking at:

www.everydayungrained.com/

: )
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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
4/3/14 8:11 P

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HI Andi!

I saw that you said you brush after your meds.
Do you take them sublingually, bc you might be flushing away some of the medication that hasn't had time to be absorbed yet.

Frankly I would hold off on all the supplements and start on the diet, remove the foods you are sensitive to and see how that goes first. I know its tough!

One of the good things about the gut, is that it sheds its enterocytes... the cells that line the intestines, every 4 days or so.

So....Once you stop putting irritating foods in your body, your body will repair itself.

Sure some of the supps your doc suggested may help, but whats going to help the most is not putting stuff in your body in the first place, that's going to harm it! Have you ever heard that story about the princess and the pea? How she could not sleep despite dozens of featherbeds piled on top of one another, she kept complaining there was something hard in her bed. It turned out to be a pea, and once it was removed, she slept soundly on one feather bed.

The moral of that fable is that getting rid of an irritant is far better than piling a bunch of things on top of it to blunt the effect of the irritant.

Going on a restricted diet that limits inflammatory foods, lets you identify what your body doesn't like. Its a lot more efficient than piling on a bunch of supplements that may even MASK the symptoms of some harmful foods.

Have a restful evening...
: )
Mzzchief



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4/3/14 12:41 A

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Thanks for the tip Hippie. I wonder how much this dr knows about the compounded meds & their absorption. I tried Acella but I'm gluten sensitive and felt the effects of the maltodextrin.

Mzz, I actually switched to a fluoride free toothpaste and brush after taking my med. My endo tests tsh and t4 only for some reason. My t4 was 0.44 (range 0.82-1.77).
Thanks for the link. Looks intense. It feels discouraging because I know I'm sensitive to gluten and corn and now this - more limitations, but I read in the link you sent me that after that diet once the gut is healed food intolerances may be removed. Keeping my fingers crossed. My dr said to consider the Specific Carbohydrate Diet which I haven't gotten any details on yet. He's recommending a whole bunch of supplements such as glutamine, IgG2000DF, OptiFiber SCFA, since i wanted a liver detox he suggests Medcaps DPO and a super high probiotic supplement (145 billion - whoa!). Also, from my testing he suspects a possible infection from a tick bite?? So I am to take the herbs Samento and Banderol. So we shall see....keep you posted. In the meantime I'm really hoping to get my thyroid levels balanced.

MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
4/1/14 11:15 P

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HI Andi!
Ya, I never liked the idea of you putting acidophilus under your tongue with your thyroid medication. I can see taking acidophilus with a meal and your thyroid under your tongue later on.

Are you using fluoride toothpaste and rinses before or immediately after taking your thyroid dose sublingually?

Has your doctor ever measured you for TSI antibodies?

I know you said your TSH was mega high, but what about your Free Ts and Free T4?
You should always test those three together. TSH is not always reliable 100% of the time.

I like Sandy's advice on the Acella, perhaps you can get that one instead of Armour.

Did your doctor put you on a special diet for LGS?
There's tons of advice online, but the main focus is in removing potential inflammatory foods like grains in general, gluten containing grains in particular, dairy(for the Casein fraction... cheese is almost pure casein, so avoid that like the plague!), soy, eggs, additives, sweeteners/sugar/alcohol, junk food

One of the great foods for this is broth, soups made from cooking meat and bones slowly for a long time in order to release the gelatin and minerals they contain... think mom's chicken soup using that whole bird, including the skin and bones... the other is leafy green veggies for their vitamins and minerals.

I know it sounds crazy but chewing your food to a paste is something everyone can do that will improve digestion, the saliva mixes with your food and starts breaking it down right away, the mashing of your food by your teeth prepares it for digestion in the stomach.

As for specifics, you might want to take a look at this one:

www.gapsdiet.com/INTRODUCTION_DIET.h
tm
l


Glad you are taking some control of your health and finally getting some answers from your doctors!

: )
Mzzchief

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HIPPIEGURL's Photo HIPPIEGURL Posts: 4,953
4/1/14 1:44 A

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ANDILIL, Didn't know if you knew this, but NDT meds will bind to the cellulose, making it not entirely absorbable into your system. That's the reason I changed from Armour after it was reformulated. They added cellulose into the fillers and a great many people had a hard time with it because they were not getting as much medication by taking their usual dose. I now take NP Thyroid, which is very much like the original Armour, which I take sublingually, and it melts under my tongue like a dream. The reformulated Armour didn't melt at all unless I crushed it and added table sugar to it before putting it under the tongue.

Edited by: HIPPIEGURL at: 4/3/2014 (18:28)
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4/1/14 12:00 A

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Hi Mzz,

So I went to the naturopathic got the results to all my tests. There's good news and bad news. I'll start with good. There's finally a diagnosis for my inflammation and weird symptoms. As you have mentioned to me before it is now confirmed I have Leaky gut Syndrome. It's good because I now know what I have. I have so many questions about LGS and have researched some but wondering if you know of any good websites/articles that discuss LGS. I have lots to learn and a new diet to adapt to. I'm hoping my diet won't be too much different since I had already started eating healthier (less preserv and carbs).
Bad news is that after 7 weeks of taking the compounded thyroid (60 mg) my tsh spiked up to 52! The weird thing is that before that I was on Armour 60 alternating with 45 and my tsh was 19. I'm thinking the acidophilus has affected the hormone absorption. Now, he's increasing my dose (90 mg) and will try a different filler like cellulose.

MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
3/9/14 1:52 P

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Glad to help!

Have a fun day!
: )
Mzzchief

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3/8/14 10:16 P

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I like to add it to my fish and chicken too but drinking it is dreadful.
My dr said it mixes well with almond milk but it doesn't help the taste. I'll see if I can add a little black pepper (can't make it any worse). Thanks for the tip!

MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
3/7/14 12:28 P

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HI Andi!
I will be interested in what your doctors say.

As for turmeric, you can get the active in turmeric, in a capsule.
The active is called curcumin.

I've also read that curcumin/turmeric isn't all that well absorbed.
So if you take it with piperine (or black pepper which contains it) or a curcumin preparation that has piperine in it already, your body will be able to use it better.

I like to add turmeric to my tuna fish or chicken salad as it gives it a pretty yellow color.
That said the amount I use is so small that it prolly doesn't make a difference!
And yes, I do put a healthy grind of black pepper in there too!

Have a happy healthy weekend!

emoticon
: )
Mzzchief

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3/6/14 4:48 P

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Hi Mzz,

Wow, you sure know how to dig into valuable information.
I have done some reading myself (whenever I can get some quiet time which is uncommon) and found so many different possible disorders linked to an elevated B12. My mind is going in circles about what it could be but don't want to do that so I will continue to eat healthy, exercise, take my supps (Fish, D3, Probitoic, Turmeric (yuck!) and Biosil - thanks to you) and wait for results from all my tests including saliva test. Thinking also about doing a liver detox but will talk to my naturopath about that.

emoticon Here's to a better tomorrow!

MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
3/2/14 5:43 P

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hi Andi, me again!

Just wanted to thank you for providing what you did about the high levels of B12 stemming from liver dysfunction. Did some reading about that this morning from my bed on my mobile phone and learned quite a bit.

A few of the things I gleaned:
The liver releases stored B12 when damage is present.
With compromised renal(kidney) function, the kidneys hold back secretion of excess serum B12, allowing B12 to rise.

There are markers to rule these two causes out.

The other cause is myeloproliferative disorders, of which there are four and which is a name applied to a group of problems with the production of blood cells in the bone marrow.

But what was most interesting was this article here:
m.clinchem.org/content/52/11/2107.fu
ll


About high B12 stemming from disorders with various immunoglobulins, in the absence of the causes listed above. This is the conclusion lifted from the article:

"Conclusions: This case demonstrates the unusual circumstance of a patient with markedly increased vitamin B12 concentrations attributed to immune complexes composed of IgG, IgM, and vitamin B12 and illustrates techniques that can be used to identify this occurrence. "


In any case, have a good week... yesterday was springtime, today it sounds like someone is throwing sand at my windows only its sleet. Not a good time to be a tree. Grateful to have shelter and can't imagine how tough it must be for the homeless and wildlife.

: )
Mzzchief

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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
3/1/14 5:21 P

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HI Andi!

Gotta apologize for getting to this so late... my router refused to connect me to Sparkpeople last week. Took a few days to figure out what was wrong, then wait to get a new router sent to me from Verizon. Plus deal with everything else that was going on in my life, one of which was surgery on my remaining elderly pomeranian. Just getting around to some of the posts now.

That link... hhhhh... I need to check my links before I go onto the next thread!
I will find another and post it here and there... thank you for telling me or I would just have gone on my merry way...

I am glad that you are checking out sensitivites to a variety of foods.
There's a close link between food allergies/leaky gut and developing a host of autoimmune disorders.

If you know anything about immune response, you know that our immune system responds to foreign proteins on the membranes of bacteria and viruses. Antibodies are created to target the bacteria/virus based on these proteins.

A healthy digestive track breaks proteins down in to their respective amino acids. When proteins from our gut, rather than amino acids are let thru in leaky gut syndrome, the body can make antibodies to these food proteins, because they're not supposed to be there. So they are perceived as bacteria/virus. The theory is that this creates an overactive immune system, which then creates antibodies to protein substances our bodies make. TPO and Thyroglobulin being the ones in autoimmune thyroid disease.

Don't forget EVERYTHING that we digest is taken from the intestines via the Portal Vein into the Liver. The liver then decides what happens. So yes, the liver is definitely involved (actually its the organ responsible for converting the most amount of T4 into T3!), but the origin of liver problems can often be the gut.



www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15253677

Have a super weekend!
: )
Mzzchief

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2/22/14 10:35 P

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Mzz, as usual thanks for all the wealthy info. I tried opening the link but it says, "Team Message Board was not found." Not sure what happened. I know that I am gluten sensitive but have tested negative for celiac disease. I was just tested for other food sensitivities - corn being one of them. It could definitely be my gut which is where the root cause for many of our health issues arise or my liver which I was reading about online. Keep you posted.
You have a great weekend too!

MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
2/20/14 7:04 P

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Hey Andi!
Thx so much for reporting back with both your pharmacist AND doctor's answers!
I would have asked: So I don't have to worry about dental decay when I take this combo pill under my tongue?

The high vitamin B12... I have had that too!
I wasn't taking B vits or a multi at the time but my levels of B12 were sky high.

So this led me to look online for answers and do a LOT of reading.
What I learned is:
The bacteria in your gut can make B12, but the ones that do, are largely in the Colon.
The colon (large intestine) is designed to only absorb water and nothing else, so the colonic bacteria couldn't be a source of the high B12 levels in the blood.

BUT you can have high vitamin B levels can from an overgrowth of bacteria in the SMALL intestines, called SIBO... "Small Intestinal Bacterial Overgrowth". Let me see if I can find something on it, hold on... okay... www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15253677

There are two case studies in this link... scroll down to the end....which are not you, but it does point to a correlation between overgrowth of bacteria, inflammation of the intestines and compromised gut mucosa.

Thx for mentioning the elevated Immunoglobulin A!
YAY that gives us more insite into what might be happening!

That your IGA is high, supports the theory you are having problems with your gut.... inflammation most likely.... and poor gut mucosa. Here's a link that talks about IGA: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immunoglobulin
_A


You will see that IGA "plays a critical role in gut mucosal immunity."

Have you ever been tested for celiac disease... intolerance to gluten?
I would suggest you ask your doctor to test you for that as well as other food sensitivities, since sensitives can cause problems as indicated in that second case study in the first link.

Stay in touch....
AND have a great weekend!

: )
Mzzchief

Edited by: MZZCHIEF at: 3/1/2014 (17:24)
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2/20/14 1:05 P

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Hi Mzz,

Your reasoning makes sense to me. I had a chat with the pharmacist again before your message and he reassured me that taking it sublingually was fine. He and my naturopathic dr have also chatted but they were more concerned about the hormone being fully absorbed with the acidophillus. Also, on my dr's notes it does say to take sublingually probably because he suspects I have GI issues. Waiting on more blood work results.
On another note, one of the lab results was emailed to me and most everything came back as normal except for elevated levels of VitB12 and Immunoglobulin IgA. What concerns me more is that the last time my VitB12 was checked (6 mo ago) it was also elevated. My pcp wasn't really concerned because she said it may be from taking my multi-vit but I know this time around I have not been consistently taking my multi so I suspect something else going on and as I researched it online it could be related to my liver. Hopefully I'm getting closer to some answers........

MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
2/18/14 11:16 P

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HI CS!

I had sluggish problems until T3(cytomel) was added.

For those that don't know, T3 is thyroid hormone that is ready to go... it doesn't need the enzyme deiodinase to remove an iodine atom from T4 (Synthroid) so that cells can use it.
Our thyroids produce BOTH T3 and T4.

My thoughts are that its best to stick with what Nature designed.
So for many people, switching to a thyroid med like one of the Porcines (Armour, Acella, Nature Thryoid, Thyroid NP, etc) is a good idea, bc these thyroid meds have BOTH T3 and T4 in them.

Another idea is to cut back on your T4 medication (Synthroid) and make up the difference with a T3 medication.

Combination T4/T3 therapy often resolves pesky hypothyroid problems that are hanging around, despite large doses of T4. Why?
Because the problem isn't that there isn't enough T4, the problem is that your deiodinases aren't doing their job and making T3 from T4 and your thyroid might even be offline, bc of high doses of Synthroid... so its not making any T3 for your body.

So CS... you may want to let your doctor know you're having problems and would like to try combination therapy. Either by cutting your dose of Synthroid (T4) and making up the difference with Cytomel (t3)... OR adding/switching to one of the Porcines.

In the meantime make sure you're getting plenty of magnesium add it to your Nutrition Tracker and see how well you are doing on this important mineral. Adding some magnesium will get things moving. Also make sure you're getting your water every day. Together these two should help. I would avoid magnesium oxide, since that tends to move things along entirely too fast if you get my drift!

What can really be a lovely way to get your magnesium, is a warm soaky tub of Epson Salts before bed. I put vitamin C in mine as the water is filling the tub (removes chlorine)... once its full I let it sit for 5 minutes, then add 2 cups Epson salts, a few drops of lavender(reduces cortisol which keeps one awake) and some glycerin to keep water in the skin. Cheap and effective!

Your adrenal glands are prolly taking a whipping, CS.
So I would say try to get a bit more vitamin C (which also moves things along) and B vitamins. Both of these help support healthy adrenals.

Have a good sleep tonite ladies and happy healthy tomorrow!
: )
Mzzchief

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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
2/18/14 10:56 P

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HI Anna!

First off I just wanted to say how much I love your new hat in your profile photo!
It looks like a halo and it very flattering to your features.
I was happy today to trade in my heavier leather hat for my straw, we've been blessed by warm weather... snowing last week, in the 70s today... that's Texas for ya!

Don't forget, as Timer said, if you have a habit that you don't want to break bc its healthy and you enjoy it... you can adjust your dose of thyroid replacement hormone around it.

Both you and Sandy have worked out a plan that fits your lifestyle, and frankly that's what its all about!

Props to two great ladies!
: )
Mzzchief



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MZZCHIEF's Photo MZZCHIEF Posts: 9,410
2/18/14 10:41 P

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HI Andi!

IMO the best way to take the capsule would be to swallow it with an 8oz glass of water to move it past the stomach and get it to the middle intestine (jejunem) which is most efficient in absorbing thyroid hormone.

Here's my reasoning:

1. Ideally your mouth should be as free of bacteria as possible.
That's why you brush, why you scrape your tongue, why you use mouth rinses.

2. Your saliva should ideally be alkaline, bc acid erodes tooth enamel.
Alkaline saliva is full of calcium ions that help re-mineralize (strengthen) your tooth enamel.
For those that don't know Alkaline is the opposite of Acidic.

3. Acidophilus probiotics, literally acido-philus means "acid-loving".
They thrive in an acidic environment.
You don't want to promote an acidic environment in your mouth.

4. Bearing #1-3 in mind, it kinda follows that your mouth isn't the best place to be dumping an acid loving bacteria, since you want to keep your mouth on the alkaline side, and you want the bacteria to thrive... in your intestines, not your mouth.
My thoughts are that the Acidophilus are being wasted, bc the stomach is really too acidic for them... which is why many savvy manufacturers go to the trouble of putting them in enteric coated capsules to survive the acid of the stomach, and open in the more alkaline environment of the small intestines.
Our stomachs are full of hydrochloric acid, one of the jobs of this acid is to kill bacteria in our foods.

So that's my reasoning... but I'm not the one that prescribed you the pills, I wasn't there when your doctor gave you the directions on how to take them. But my money is on your doctor having told you to swallow your combo pills with an 8 oz glass of water.

I would print out what I said here, let your doctor read it first.
Then listen to whatever he/she says.

I would be very interested in what your doctor says... as I know you are!
Please let us know as we are always learning here.

Thx, Andi!
emoticon
Mzzchief

Edited by: MZZCHIEF at: 2/18/2014 (22:43)
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Just curious; Did anyone have any sluggish problems after your dosage was lowerd? I was taking Synthroid 200MCG and at my last visit the doctor lowered it to 175MCG. The last couple of days I have had no energy at all and this is not like me.

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Hi Anna,
I also take my T4(Tirosint) in the middle of the night so I can eat breakfast right away upon arising. I also take HP Thyroid by Acella, which is nearly identical to the original formulation of Armour, as it melts very easily when taken sublingually. I take my NP sublingually around noontime so the T3 in it supports me during my most active part of the day without keeping me awake at night.

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Everytime I check this thread, I always learn something new.
I will rethink using my Himalayan salt now and not drink so
much Rooibos tea. As for taking with vitamins, I take my
Oroxine when I get up for my nightly visit to the loo.
So then when I get up in the morning, I am able to have my
breakfast straight away as at least 4 hours have passed.
Thanks again for all the great advice Mzz.

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2/17/14 8:50 P

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The pharmacist said I could take it anyway I wanted to. Hmmm...I could try just swallowing the capsule but I wanted to avoid that. I could also open capsule and swallow?? No, my doctor does not know yet, but I will let him know. I just want to make sure I'm doing this right before I continue.

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HI Andi!

My concern is you taking acidolphilus under your tongue.
Most probiotics on the market are put in a coated pill casing that is designed to be release the probiotics, once it reaches the alkaline environment of the small intestine.

Our mouths ideally are to be germ free.

So my thoughts here are that acidolphilus would not something you want to release in your mouth.

Does your doctor know you are taking this custom combo of acidolphilus and thyroid hormone this way?

: )
Mzzchief

Edited by: MZZCHIEF at: 2/17/2014 (16:33)
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Hi Mzz,

Thanks for the info on what could affect absorption of thyroid hormone. I open the capsule of porcine w/acidophilus and take it sublingually. If I take it sublingually I do not have to really wait until lunch to take my supplements right? Also, do you think the acidophilus affects its absorption at all?

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HI Timer!

You are 100% correct... if you keep the same habits (in this case having a cup of tea or coffee with breakfast) every day, then your dose of thyroid medication can be adjusted around your habits!

Good thinking!
There is more than one road to Mecca as they say... its best to find what works for you and stick with it until that changes. For example I did GREAT on Synthroid... until I went into perimenopause at 53. About a year later, my dose of thyroid was adjusted by cutting back on the Synthroid (a T4 only medication) and making up the rest of my dosage with Cytomel (a t3 thyroid hormone). For whatever reason... either my thyroid disease had gotten worse, or the amount/ ratio of my female hormones were changing... my cells and liver (the big converter of T4 to T3, and the binder of thyroid hormone to transporter proteins)... weren't making sufficient T3 for my needs. So even though my T4 was high, my T3 was out of range low and my reverse T3 was high... and I was symptomatic.

This might sound like gobblygook to you, but suffice it to say that sometimes our bodies will handle thyroid hormone differently dependent on the circumstances.

Winter seems to be tough on us thyroid peeps... low light conditions and the colder temps can be depressing and sap the strength of just about anyone!

If you are dragging and otherwise feeling blah, you may benefit from some Cytomel or switching to a Porcine like Armour., Acella, Naturethyroid, Thyroid NP which have both T4 and T3. That's something that you and your doctor have to decide after testing your T3 levels.

Also pay attention to exercise, sleep and nutrition... getting some time for yourself/stress reduction.
Its easy to slack on those when its Winter.
But these four can make a pretty profound difference in the way you feel.

Have a fun Sunday!
: )
Mzzchief

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wow! More things I didn't know. Of course, I love Rooibos tea! So same for black tea. At times I take my synthroid in AM with tea! ugh! I know that it absorbs better w/o food but i thought I could just adjust my dose ie have a higher dose b/c I can't wait to eat breakfast. I didn't get my exact TSH level last time but the doc said it was low and wanted me to wait another month to have it rechecked. I don't really want to go down on the dose b/c I hate the feeling when I'm hypo (TSH is high). In general, I had a hard enough time getting off the couch today!

Life is what you make of it.


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Thx for the update, Andi, glad you found something thatt worked for you after all you have been thru.

Time....

Good call on reminding the Team that iron blocks the absorption of thyroid hormone! Same too, with calcium, minerals, some vitamins, soy and fiber. That's why I put" Wait until lunch for vitamins and minerals" in the team huddle most days of the week.

The one vitamin that helps you absorb more of your T4 (Synthroid) is vitamin C.
Also taking it with distilled water since it has no dissolved minerals.
AND 8 oz with your pill, to flush it out of your stomach.
Otherwise it will get stuck there... thyroid hormone isn't one of the 4 things that can get past the stomach's protective mucous lining.

As for Himalayan salt....
Its a very pretty color and looks great as a lamp, illuminated from underneath the salt crystal. That's the only good thing I can say about it.

Himalayan salt has varying levels of fluoride in it.
Fluoride was what was used years ago to treat people with hyperthyroidism... too much thyroid hormone. It also contains iron, which is what gives it that gorgeous pink color. So please be careful with it!

While we are on the topic, All forms of Tea source from camellia sinensis (traditional teas), have varying amounts of fluoride in them. It varies according to where it was grown, and how old the leaves are at harvest, with green and white teas having the least amount of fluoride. As does Rooibos (red bush) tea, from a plant indigenous to Africa, unrelated to true tea plants. Certain plants just seem to concentrate it.

While we are on the topic, if you brush with a fluoride paste, do yourself a favor and scrape your tongue afterwards and rinse. You will be shocked how much paste remains in your tongue tissue.

Yes, if you have the autoimmune form of thyroid disease... and most of us do... you've got to be very careful with iodine. Over supplementation can flair autoimmune conditions... increase your TPO auto-antibodies. Especially if its not offset with selenium. Selenium supplementation can be tricky as well, as it can bring on type 2 diabetes.

So be careful, peeps.
Only one body per soul this life cycle!
: )
Mzzchief

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I love this thread. It has so much information. Thank you both for sharing. I know this is a little off topic of allergies but the other thing I learned the hard way was not to take synthroid within 2 hours of taking iron b/c the amt of synthroid will be reduced. Again some what different topic but I think at one point I was using salt w/o iodine and i thought that worsened by symptoms but at the time there was other stuff going on so it was hard to tease out. Now I use Himalayan salt if I add salt.

Life is what you make of it.


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Update: SO, I did not do well on Nature-Throid. Tried it for barely a week because it gave me achy joints all over. I switched back to Armour and felt better. How weird! Also, I started taking fish oil for inflammation and that helped. Krill oil didn't do much for me. Well, went to a naturopahtic dr during that time. Awesome dr. He suggested trying a compounded capsule of only dessicated thyroid plus acidophilus, no fillers. The pharmacist had little faith as I did but as soon as I took it I felt better, had less inflammation, and no more jitters. I can't believe the effect the fillers were having on me! I take it sublingually and it dissolves super fast. Only problem is that its super expensive compared to Armour but I will do it for sake of my health. Also, I didn't think of this til later but if I'm taking acidophilus together with the dessicated thyroid wouldn't that affect the absorption of hormone. I figured the pharmacist would have thought of that.
So happy to feel great again! emoticon


Edited by: ANDILIL at: 2/13/2014 (19:37)
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Andi!
Glad to hear you are doing so well with your diet and avoiding potential allergens in your diet!
Way to go... I know how difficult it can be, as I have had to forego gluten containing anything since 2007. Gluten allergy has, however, been really helpful in making my food choices a lot more "virtuous" and there are a lot of empty calories in the sorts of food that are made with wheat... pasta, pies, cookies, cakes, breads, etc.

As for the Biosil, it comes in pill or liquid form.
I have been using the liquid form for years, I just mix it into some water.
I love what it does for my skin.

Some other inflammation fighters are astaxanthin (also good for skin), cinnamon ( good in particular, when you are carbs, bc it helps lower blood sugar) and a form of CoQ10 called Ubiquinonol. There are two forms of CoQ10, Ubiquinone and Ubiquinol... you want the one with the -ol at the end of it, bc its easier for your body to use it... its good to go.

These may help your knees as well.
But the only way you'll know is to try them.

Keep up the good habits!
: )
Mzzchief

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12/18/13 6:14 P

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Mzzchief,

Good to know! I just knew I was sensitive to corn and was avoiding anything that had corn (corn starch, meal, syrup). It was actually NP Thyroid that I tried, but I felt gluten effects from the maltodextrin. Will try the Biosil!
Thanks!

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Andi!

So happy to see you are making progress with this!
The amount of corn in Armour is minimal, and its in the form of corn starch.
Starch is the carbohydrate portion of the corn kernel.
It helps to have a bit of knowledge about allergies...
With allergies, usually the PROTEIN fraction that a person is allergic to.
For example gluten is a protein.

So with this in mind, and the wee amount of cornstarch that's actually in Armour, I don't see you having problems until you start to have problems! ha

If I remember correctly you didn't do so well on Naturethyroid, but that might have been from over medication on it?

IMO the resolution of your symptoms (metallic taste in your mouth, aches and pains) are more from:
1. lowering your dosage of thyroid medication
2. getting the proper amount of T3 and T4 hormones from a Porcine medication... Synthroid only has T4
3. Avoiding gluten... there is a "washout period" that takes time to get it out of your system and your gut to repair itself
4. Avoiding corn
5. Eating a more nutritious diet inclusive of upping your fruits and veggies.
6. Reducing processed foods in your diet

You might consider giving your situation more time as inflammation takes a while to go down... months sometimes... after changes have been made.

As for your knees you might consider Biosil which contains silica in a form that's easily absorbed by the body. Its good for hair and skin, too.

A quality fish oil another inflammation fighter, but you have to be able to tolerate it. Or you can eat cold water fish 2xs a week in lieu of the oil. Along these same lines, astaxathin, a carotenoid that gives Salmon its pink color, can be helpful for general inflammation.

Do your research before trying any of these before taking them... which may include asking your doctor if these supplements are appropriate for your particular situation.

Be well!
: )
Mzzchief



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Thanks for the info Mzz.

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12/15/13 10:47 P

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Thanks Mzzchief!

Update: Making progress in solving this riddle. Since I've been taking Armour the metallic taste in mouth and muscle pains are gone. The tingling sensations were due to being gluten sensitive. I noticed it was better but still felt some tingling so turns out I'm also sensitive to corn emoticon . So I've eliminated both in my diet and I feel much better emoticon . Eating fresh fruits & vegetables and less processed foods. Still have some inflammation at knees, but dr says its not in my joints. I think its due to something in medication. While I feel much better on Armour thinking about switching to Nature Throid since it does not have corn and Armour does. I don't want to keep switching but trying to solve the riddle. Also, dr and I are still trying to figure out the "right dosage" for me. Currently, I'm alternating 60 mg and 45 mg.

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JM
Tirosint we are finding, tends to be absorbed into the body more readily, which can cause problems for some people when it "hits". Sometimes it results in needing less Tirosint than conventional meds or they become a bit too hyper... Tirosint seems to be more "bioavailable".

The upside is that it doesn't seem to be not affected by coffee drinking.
thyroid.about.com/b/2012/02/21/tiros
in
t-bypasses-coffees-effect-on-thyroidR>-drug-absorption.htm


Don't know if your doctors have told you, but the protocol for taking our thyroid meds, are:
1. on an empty stomach, with
2.a FULL oz glass of water to get the pill out of the stomach and to the middle intestine where the bulk of it is absorbed,
3. Wait 30 minutes, an hour is better before eating
4. Take all meds, vitamins and minerals 4 hours later
5. Avoid soy protein, stuff like soy milk, especially the first meal following dosing on your Thyroid hormone.

This allows your medication to be absorbed most readily.

Glad you are doing better. Sometimes it takes a year or longer to start feeling normal again.
: )
Mzzchief

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Looks like my doctor didn't read up on how to prescribe Tirosint. He over medicated me and Tirosint made me achy and I had no energy. My doctor then put me on Unithroid, same problem as Synthroid. I asked my doctor if he prescribed Armour. He said that he didn't and I would have to find another doctor, which I did. it was been a week and so far so good.

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Gorgon

Sorry to hear of your dilemma, its sounds like torture.

Have you been allergy tested at your doctors?

In the meantime you may want to cut all processed foods and eat organic.

You might try laundering your clothes with borax and a vinegar rinse.
Do an extra rinse cycle on your wash.
Unless you work in a restaurant, garage or are a painter or some other profession where your clothes become a mess, or you wear the same items for days on end, you really don't need to use detergent every time you wash your clothes. They just don't get that dirty.

Definitely go dye free on your meds.

You can use milk of magnesia as a deodorant. I'd use conditioner and shampoo sparingly... find one with a short list of ingredients. Fractionated coconut oil is a good body oil instead of lotion. When its fractionated it tends not to be as greasy on the skin.

If you are using a fluoride tooth paste or rinse, that could be causing problems too. Look for a toothpaste that doesn't have fluoride, or simply use baking soda. Here's where you can do more reading : https://www.google.com/#q=fluoride+a
nd
+itchy+skin


Let us know if how you're doing.
Welcome to our team.
: )
Mzzchief

Edited by: MZZCHIEF at: 12/15/2013 (13:55)
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Thank you Sandy for supplying the Tirosint user experience!
Its good to have you on our team... especially when I'm not getting Forum updates.

For those who don't know, Sandy (hippiegirl) is one of our experienced thyroid forum members.

: )
Mzzchief

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JMPeterson~

Welcome to our Forum. I see you have only one post here.
Too much thyroid hormone can cause diarrhea.
So can magnesium supplements and vitamin C.

Tirosint is made with 4 ingredients, gelatin (the shell), T4 (levothyroxine),water and glycerin(whats inside the shell). It is a good alternative to conventional medications, because its got ingredients that are found in the body. But you can be over medicated with Tirosint too.

You've gotta be like Goldilocks. Not too little, not too much.... just right.
Otherwise there's problems.

How are you feeling?

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I didn't see all the updates to this thread since I last posted.

So here's my opinion on just about everything written since my last reply on 4/24/13. LOL

Andi before we start on this road, I'll tell you that thyroid disease can trigger a host of problems. Its usually over or under medication, not the right ratio of T3 to T4, bad nutrition, other medications, peri menopause, other diseases aggravated by a poorly functioning thyroid over the years, the body's adjustment after diagnosis to thyroid hormone replacement after a period of little circulating thyroid hormone.

Your thyroid hormone medication, is the hero in this situation, but frequently gets blamed for symptoms not of its making, because you have started taking it at the same time you were diagnosed with thyroid problems, or because you are over or under medicated.

Now that we have that out of the way...


Andi on 4/25 you wrote:
" I meant that its been a year and I still cough and taste my daily dose of Synthroid. To me its more of a metallic taste."

A metallic taste in your mouth isn't Synthroid or any other thyroid medication. Are you taking zinc by any chance? Too much zinc can cause a build up of copper which can cause a metallic taste. Some denture creams have zinc in them, if you wear dentures. Here's a link of things that can possibly cause a metallic taste. Feel free to run your own search and discuss your findings here. You will notice that "anti-thyroid medication" is listed. This is NOT thyroid hormone, its drugs that shut the thyroid down.
www.drweil.com/drw/u/QAA350574/Metal
li
c-Taste-in-Your-Mouth.html


On 6/9/13 you wrote this, see my comments in all caps.
"
"A quick update.
I went to Johns Hopkins and they told me:
1) Synthroid doesn't typically cause musculoskeletal issues AGREED
2) My TSH is really low (0.142) so they will lower my dose to see if that helps with the symptoms GOOD IDEA, THAT'S WHAT I TOLD YOU ON 4/24/13
3) They do not want me to try Armour because it could make my symptoms worse and is inconsistent. WHEN YOU'RE ON TOO MUCH THYROID HORMONE, THE BEST COURSE OF ACTION IS TO LOWER YOUR DOSE, WAIT A FEW MONTHS, REASSESS AFTER TESTING AND SYMPTOM REMISSION.
4) My blood work results state "Studies have demonstrated that endomysial IgA antibodies have over 99% specificity for gluten sensitive enteropathy." THAT'S A GENERIC STATEMENT. IT DOESN'T SAY YOU HAVE ENDOMYSIAL IGA ANTIBODIES. THERE SHOULD BE A COUNT AND A REFERENCE RANGE ON YOUR TEST. WHAT ARE THOSE NUMBERS?

So does that mean I'm gluten intolerant? WE NEED THE REFERENCE RANGE FOR THE TEST, AND YOUR NUMBER ON THAT RANGE.

If so, that would explain the tingling in the legs and arms. Should I get other tests done? NOT YET.

On 12/11/13 you wrote:
"Levo & Synthroid 50 mcg has no dyes. It's a white tablet. Switching might be a good idea anyway because I noticed you said you developed a milk allergy and Synthroid has lactose. GOOD WORK! THIS INFORMATION IS TRUE. YOU CAN ALSO ASK YOUR PHARMACIST FOR DYE FREE. IT COMES DYE FREE IN BOTTLES OF 100. YOU CAN EITHER BUY THE WHOLE BOTTLE OR ASK THEM TO SOURCE A MONTH'S MEDICATION FROM THAT.

I couldn't take Synthroid because I am sensitive to gluten and could feel the effects of it.SYNTHROID IS GLUTEN FREE.

: )
Mzzchief




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12/11/13 11:03 P

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Levo & Synthroid 50 mcg has no dyes. It's a white tablet. Switching might be a good idea anyway because I noticed you said you developed a milk allergy and Synthroid has lactose. I couldn't take Synthroid because I am sensitive to gluten and could feel the effects of it. Abbott lab cannot guarantee its gluten free because they haven't tested for it.
Hope Levo works for you! (If not, there are other options)

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I have Hashimotos and I have the ITCHY problem too!..I've changed everything in my life trying to figure out what this affliction is. I only eat whole foods no dairy no gluten..I've recently developed a milk allergy. I have thrown out all my clothes twice (very tramatic) gotten rid of carpet in house, changed soaps to all natural no perfumes as well with detergents etc and been to see a dermatologist a few times, doctors and entomologists with no success.
Today it occured to me after 5 years of absolute maddening misery that it might be an allergy to an ingredient in my Synthroid. Possibly the dye FD&C Yellow No 6 which is a commonality between the different doseages that I've been on in the last few years. I am considering the dyes because I have had sensitivities to dyes in clothes in the past. I am developing allergies to practically everything that I come into contact with recently. I wonder if the constant barrage of one allergen could cause me to be more sensitive and reach a breaking point at which time I develope even more allergies..perhaps this IS what Hashimotos does.
I have just switched from Synthroid 125 mcg made by Abbvi containing the following dyes FD&C yellow No5, FD&C Red No40, and FD&C Blue No1 ( it also contains: Acacia, confectioners sugar (which has cornstarch in it) lactose monhydrate,Magnesium Stearate, povidone and Talc. I'm switching to Levothyroxine made by Mylan.
I will post any improvements in my Itch condition with the new Levo. The pill is off white and so may not contain dyes I have yet to research that. I joined today because of this thread. I look forward to hearing from anyone with anything to say on this.:)






Edited by: GORGONSEYE at: 12/11/2013 (21:39)
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8/7/13 4:18 P

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Sandy,thanks for the information, I have looked at it since my posting. My Doc is close to retirement and doesn't always think, I'll let you know how it works out, Michelle

Edited by: TAMU88 at: 8/7/2013 (16:20)
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8/7/13 4:09 P

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You might want to try Tirosint. It doesn't have the fillers that Synthroid does, it's just straight T4 in a liquid gelcap. I've been using it since Levoxyl went off the shelves and haven't had a problem.

tirosint.com/

Sandy



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8/6/13 12:38 P

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Sorry to hear that, me too! My second day was the same as your sufferings and I will not take Synthroid, ever again. I have be on Levoxyl 75MCG for over a decade, now it's gone. the Levothroxine was a waste of time, at 19 days I realized the generic was not working. (The MA goofed and the pharmacist said 'it's the same".) After returning to Levoxyl it was only 3 days to recover from the "generic Levoxyl". I don't know what I should try next, and I am allergic to pork. any help?

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8/4/13 10:02 A

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I am having a different reaction to Synthroid. I recently switched from Naturethroid because hypo symptoms returned (too much T3). Dr. prescribed 120 mcg. of Synthroid. Within five minutes after taking my pill I get abdominal cramps and run to the bathroom with dirrahea. Have had loose stools the entire time. Happens both with full glass of water or hardly any water. Got retested after 6 wks and it turns out I am over medicated. Lowered my dose and said this should go away in three days (it has not). I am confused because this reaction started on day 1 upon switching. Dr wants me to try new dose for a week and let him know what happens. He said we could try Tirosint if this doesn't go away. Could I be reacting to the fillers?

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6/10/13 12:17 A

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Hi,
A quick update. I went to Johns Hopkins and they told me 1) Synthroid doesn't typically cause musculoskeletal issues 2) My TSH is really low (0.142) so they will lower my dose to see if that helps with the symptoms 3) They do not want me to try Armour because it could make my symptoms worse and is inconsistent. 4) My blood work results state "Studies have demonstrated that endomysial IgA antibodies have over 99% specificity for gluten sensitive enteropathy." So does that mean I'm gluten intolerant? If so, that would explain the tingling in the legs and arms. Should I get other tests done? My others levels were in the normal range.

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4/25/13 10:33 P

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Sorry, misunderstood towards the end. I know it wouldn't stay in throat for a year emoticon I meant that its been a year and I still cough and taste my daily dose of Synthroid. To me its more of a metallic taste.
I really think my med plays a role in my asthma. Maybe because there's a lot of free thyroid hormone in my blood like you said.

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4/24/13 11:03 A

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Andy

I seem to remember that you were on too much thyroid hormone at one point (your TSH was super low and your levels of thyroid hormone high) which would account for chest pains.

If you are still tasting Synthroid from a year ago when you cough, then you are confusing the taste of Synthroid (mild sweet flavor) with something else. Synthroid is not going to stay in your throat for over a year, girl. More than likely it was something you ate.

Best of luck with this!
: )
Mzzchief


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4/24/13 12:50 A

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I gave it 2.5 weeks and I wish it did work, but it gave me terrible sharp chest pains. Being hypo allergenic I don't understand why. I read on another forum of people who experienced the same thing. ??
Anyway, a quick update. After being on levo 50s for some months I noticed my hair thinning and swollen glands?? I asked my doc if I could try Synthroid 50s so I have been on that for 2 weeks and its not much better. I have tingling in my legs and a tight feeling around my neck. These symptoms seem so unusual to me. I had a sonogram of my neck and it looked normal. I went to a neurologist and so far from all the tests -nothing. My doctor referred me to Johns Hopkins so we shall see. My doc is not very willing to put me on Armour and I'm feeling hesitant about it also but at this point I'm willing to try anything that might help me feel better. My asthma continues...somewhat controlled...which started around the same time my doc increased my dose of Synthroid about a year ago (being pregnant) and when I cough I can still taste it. I've also noticed slight changes with my asthma symptoms when I change my THR.


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