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RUNNINGMOMOF2's Photo RUNNINGMOMOF2 SparkPoints: (29,118)
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1/25/12 11:39 P

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She ended up on Zymax and has done really well. The ears have resolved well with Zymax and another drug in combination.

I'm sorry that I haven't posted in response. I've had some really bad news about her, but will start a new thread about that under raw food diet.

13.1: 2:11:01 PR (12/6/09)
10K: 1:05:08 (4/11/10)
5K: 28:29 (1/30/10)
_____________________

2011 RACES:
2/13 - Meso 8K (52.53)
2/20 - 13.1, A1A Ft.L (2:29)


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LORIELP's Photo LORIELP Posts: 2,120
12/30/11 11:17 A

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I too have a dog who has cronic ear problems. He did not really respond to the meds from the vet. I found a product called Zymox. It has enzymes to clear up bacterial and veast infections. It is the thing that finnally did the trick. My little guy had large chunks of what looked like black tar come out of his ears. I used Zymox for the 7 days and he has not had any more issues with his ears in over a year. It also has Hydrocortisone for allergies and itching. I found it on Ebay. Lorraine

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HOUNDLOVER1's Photo HOUNDLOVER1 Posts: 8,067
12/29/11 11:26 P

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Hope you'll find something that will make her feel better. There is another thing that I thought of which I know works well for arthritis for many people and animals. It is the spice turmeric. It seems to work as a natural anti-inflammatory and possibly reduces pain and it has no dangerous side effects. You can find it at health food stores or order by the pound online. I can't remember the dosage that is recommended but you should be able to find that on the internet easily.
As far as a splint, that is a difficult decision to make. If she would benefit from one I can't see why it would have to cost that much money at all. I would talk to a canine orthopedist (any major vet school has one) before going that way. The reason I would be cautious is that the more you stabilize one joint the more the other joints have to make up for the lack of range in motion, putting unnatural stress on them. This is especially difficult for a heavy, big breed like a bullmastiff. The other disadvantage with a brace is that it may limit the motion of muscles that are still functioning to some degree.
I would think that one thing that is absolutely critical for her is to keep her weight on the low end of normal to where you can easily see an hourglass shape between the ribcage and the haunches. The less weight her joints have to carry the better. If you can afford it I would also encourage you to feed at least some raw meat and bones (separate from any dry food) because there are nutrients that dogs can only get from this. All dry and canned dog food is highly processed and some nutrients are lost.
For the ear infections you may need both an antibiotic and an antifungal medication from your vet for a while. Once the infections are under control you may be able to prevent infections from recurring by applying small amounts of virgin coconutoil to the ear canal. This has worked fairly well for my Cocker Spaniel that has chronic ear infections. Virgin coconutoil has both antibacterial and antifungal qualities. Dogs with chronic ear infections often suffer because of an underlying food allergy which causes an inflammation response of the ears, skin and/or lips. Feeding a hypoallergenic diet can help relieve this response. The most common allergens in dogs are probably wheat, corn, soy and egg. The next common are likely chicken and beef so I would find a food without any of those to start with. To treat allergy symptoms short-term you can use Benadryl (or generic diphenhydramine) at the same dosage as for people for a dog of this size, 50 mg .
Concerning the Cetyl M, start with a "loading dose", which is 4 times the maintenance dose. You may see significant improvement in as little as a week or it could take several weeks. Cetyl M contains a fair amount of glucosamine along with cetyl myristoleate so you can probably stop giving glucosamine separately.



You can talk to God all you want and that's great, but the changes happen when you start listening to him.

BE THE CHANGE YOU WANT TO SEE IN OTHERS.




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RUNNINGMOMOF2's Photo RUNNINGMOMOF2 SparkPoints: (29,118)
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12/29/11 9:25 P

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Hi and thank you all for the input.

Winnie has a surgically repaired elbow, there is a ton of hardware and I think both my vet, me and the rescue group is a bit puzzled as to what happened. I'm going to see if I can upload a small copy of her x-rays to my spark page so you can see. It doesn't look like I can add it here.

She was found as a stray so no one knows really what happened to her. Someone must have cared for her at some time because like we all know surgery of any type is hardly inexpensive. She's a bullmastiff and some of them are prone to elbow dysplasia and this is what they fixed, but she's fairly young and from my research, that type of surgery is fixed with an arthroscopic procedure and even if you go regular surgery, you wouldn't put major hardware like there is here. She does have arthritis now which is a post operative change in the elbow my vet told me.

I'm going to try to supplement her with Cetyl M and see if it makes a difference for her.

Rimadyl was our first try for pain management. My vet gave us a month supply and she became really depressed and on physical exam (there are some chronic ear infections too) for her ear, my vet thought her spleen felt like it was enlarged so the decision was made to take her off the Rimadyl and see if she would bounce back or if we needed to do additional testing. She appears to have bounced back and has perked up a bit. We are going back for yet another ear check tomorrow. My vet said she's had ear infections for so long she now has chronic changes in her ears and there is fungus and bacteria. We are going down the list of medication to see what she responds best too.

I'm also curious to see if a brace would help? Has anyone tried something like that? I was on a web site (http://handicappedpets.mobi/index.php/hel
p-pets-walk/k9-dog-orthotic-brace.html) and they have an elbow brace for, oh, $600, but it talks about arthritic changes and providing stability as well....

Her temperament is excellent and she is very sweet even with the discomfort and pain, plus the ear infection...poor thing...

Thanks for the continued brain storm!

13.1: 2:11:01 PR (12/6/09)
10K: 1:05:08 (4/11/10)
5K: 28:29 (1/30/10)
_____________________

2011 RACES:
2/13 - Meso 8K (52.53)
2/20 - 13.1, A1A Ft.L (2:29)


 current weight: 144.6 
 
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HOUNDLOVER1's Photo HOUNDLOVER1 Posts: 8,067
12/29/11 1:03 A

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I realized I better clarify. Was this elbow surgically fused (because of arthritis) or did it fuse naturally (either as a result of arthritis and lack of use or some other cause). If the joint was surgically fused and the dog has pain it's important to find out what the reason is since the purpose of surgery is usually to alleviate severe arthritis pain in that joint. Is there scar tissue from the surgery that pinches a nerve (nerve pain can be very severe requiring narcotic pain meds. Are the joint above and below the elbow (shoulder and pastern) stressed because they have to compensate for the lack of movement in the elbow?
I would clear this up by having the dog see a canine orthopedic specialist and have some x-rays done.
If there was no surgical fusion, then there is the question whether there is any movement left in the elbow. If there is I think Cetyl M might be worth trying because there may be severe arthritis in this joint.
With I knew more, hope you find someone who can give you a better idea.
Birgit

You can talk to God all you want and that's great, but the changes happen when you start listening to him.

BE THE CHANGE YOU WANT TO SEE IN OTHERS.




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KATHYSCOLLIES's Photo KATHYSCOLLIES Posts: 16,430
12/28/11 11:32 P

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From my understanding, a fused joint is somewhat different to arthritis.

Just over 3 1/2 years ago I was doing competitive obedience with my Lucky. Less than two months later he could not sit without falling over. After doing extensive tests and multiple x-rays, we were told that he had a small bony growth on his right front shoulder which was starting to fuse the joint, as well as a very large bony growth on his left hip which had almost completely fused the joint 'shut'. Because he also had a partially calcified knee on the same back leg, from an old injury, and had 3 compromised joints in total, even had I been able to afford it, he was not considered to be a good candidate for surgery. The recovery time and pain management levels were not in his favour.

All of his files were sent by our vets (without my knowledge ) to the veterinary school in the province and were reviewed by two of the top veterinary orthopaedic specialists / surgeons in Canada. They agreed completely with the diagnosis and treatment plan laid out by our own vets, which essentially was to keep him as comfortable as I could for as long as I could. The specialists could not believe that I had been competing with him in July (this was now September) because they had never seen a dog with this level of joint fusion that had not been incapacitated for at least a year or two! We were very fortunate that they did not charge a single penny for their consultations, and were told that he had been included in their teaching program.

He had some underlying health issues that we didn't know about at that time, which were completely exacerbated by his joint problems, and I lost him shortly thereafter. He weighed about 75 lbs, and like all my dogs was a registered Rough Collie. There was absolutely no history of anything like this at all, anywhere in his background for at least 15 or more generations, so it was not something deemed to be even remotely genetic. I know this for a fact, since he was one of my own breeding.

While he did do fairly well once we worked out exactly what pain medications and doses he managed best on, even without the other problems that ultimately caused his death, the best prognosis we were given was from 1 - 2 years, before there would most likely be no way to keep the pain at a liveable level for him.

I wish you good luck, and hopefully a better outcome than I had with my boy. He's the one in my profile pic.

Edited by: KATHYSCOLLIES at: 12/28/2011 (23:33)
Kathy

A truly happy person is one who can enjoy the scenery on a detour.

Don't cry because it is over, smile because it happened!

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DODDSM's Photo DODDSM Posts: 3,541
12/28/11 10:53 P

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I would ask your vet about Oximunol ( www.avivagen.com/content/oximunol-ch
ew
ables
) Phoenix has bad joints (which I know isn't your problem) but I have seen remarkable difference since we added this to his daily regime of medication. You could even e-mail the company (or you vet could) to see if they think it would be of benefit to your dog. They have a vet that they work with, and she is fabulous.

Another thing I would recommend is Natural Defense Healthy Joint Treats ( naturaldefense.ca/JointCare.aspx ). Phoenix gets 1 treat a day, and again has really helped with his mobility levels.

For pain management over the years, we have found Duramaxx or Metacam has worked the best for our dogs - have you tried anything other then the Remedyl? Our Lucky had an almost fused hip joint (which we didn't know about until we did x-rays) and a compromised front knee joint. We did Cartrophen injections (4 injections for the first month, then 1 injection as the dog needs it); and he was on either Metacam or Duramaxx, to help keep him comfortable.


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HOUNDLOVER1's Photo HOUNDLOVER1 Posts: 8,067
12/28/11 10:10 P

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Something I had very good experiences with that is worth trying is Cetyl M.
Here is a link for their website. Click on the video with the dog towards the bottom on the screen.
www.responseproducts.com/
The results of this product are not always this dramatic but I've had huge improvements with my horse that has arthritis in the hocks.

Good luck, and let us know what happens,
Birgit

Edited by: HOUNDLOVER1 at: 12/28/2011 (22:29)
You can talk to God all you want and that's great, but the changes happen when you start listening to him.

BE THE CHANGE YOU WANT TO SEE IN OTHERS.




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RUNNINGMOMOF2's Photo RUNNINGMOMOF2 SparkPoints: (29,118)
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12/28/11 9:23 P

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Hi,

I have a foster dog with a fused elbow on a front leg....has anyone had any exposure to a dog with this before? We are guessing she is about 4 years old, very sweet and well mannered. She has a difficult time walking of course and muscle atrophy on the leg since it is very limited. There is also arthritis. My vet told me that there is not a whole lot we can do, it's one of those 'it is what it is' things.

She is about 75 lbs and I'm considering adopting her because she fits in very well in our family. Just want to think it through since she has some limitations with her mobility and challenged when it comes to getting up to walk sometimes. She can walk as much as she want or doesn't want once she's on her feet.

She came to the shelter as a stray and we can tell that she has had puppies. We don't know the cause or why her elbow was fused. Good guess is that it has been a couple of years since her surgery based on the age of the scar.

She's getting glucosamine everyday. She did not respond well to Rimadyl.

Curious to hear if anyone else has encountered this in a big dog and what the outcome has been?

Thanks!

Edited by: RUNNINGMOMOF2 at: 12/28/2011 (21:24)
13.1: 2:11:01 PR (12/6/09)
10K: 1:05:08 (4/11/10)
5K: 28:29 (1/30/10)
_____________________

2011 RACES:
2/13 - Meso 8K (52.53)
2/20 - 13.1, A1A Ft.L (2:29)


 current weight: 144.6 
 
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