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SASSISPRING's Photo SASSISPRING Posts: 11,077
8/13/09 12:32 P

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Sophie, for myself, once the final papers were signed by the credit company and recieved by my credit counsellor, I am no longer obligated to any collection agency and the file is returned to the credit card company. The agency - as my counsellor explained - loses all the money they paid to own the file. That's the reason for the aggression, as they were fully aware that they purchased a file that was under discussion for debt consolidation.

Until that is complete though, they are legally allowed to do whatever they choose to get the money collected on that debt.

Sears Canada that merged with Citibank, they were the worst. They hung onto my account for a long time after the paperwork was complete. They sent me threatening letters and attempted to call. I would give them my counsellor's name and phone, then hang up. The other credit counsellor, she was furious because she sent off letters and talked on the phone to inform they were acting illegally. Finally she had enough - as she put it - and they'd either listen or legal proceedings would occur. *chuckle* That's when I realized how valuable credit counsellors are - truly work for their money. That was the end of it, no more threats and now they accept the payments as agreed.

Canadian Tire settled immediately, however, they played games for almost 2 months with the paperwork. First it went to one desk, then another desk, then another .... and my counsellor was very frustrated with the game as I'm incurring interest until the final papers are signed. He got that stopped pretty fast too.

The thing is agencies believe "we" are too stupid to realize there are laws protecting us. Like when the agency told my nephew - a child - that his parents were losers, they were not responsible at all and they should be jailed for running out on their debt. My nephew said he listened and at the end of the rant said "I'm 12, you are not allowed to do this and my parents aren't stupid, you are" and then hung up. LOL!

The agent apparently asked for his mother, he said she was in the shower and the agent said he was lying. Asked for his father, said his dad was at work. The agent said again he was lying, then went off on the rant. My nephew was so furious and even he knew that an agent shouldn't discuss these things with a child - they knew he was the child, he told them that. Crazy eh. The best thing that happened to my brother and his wife was having that car repo'd.

As for the in-writing, that is what my brother is waiting on. Ford Canada sold his file about 15 or 17yrs ago when he turned in a truck after the lease was up. He owed on something that he disputed and at the end of the day, it was paid off, closed. Occasionally it comes up on credit checks as a lean - not always, its random. He has contacted Ford Canada who denies having the file and in their opinion, it was closed. He spoke to the company who supposedly holds it and they are asking for an amount that is like triple what was orginally paid. It all sounds suspious. He checked the laws and as you shared, it stated that this should have been cleared and one has to get in writing what is owed, to who etc. He requested this more than once and each time he requests it in writing, the company stops contacting him and it "disappears" off the radar. He asked the bank financial manager this year about it and she basically said that once a file is sold, its really hard to track what's happened to it. I think that Canada has to toughen up laws regarding these types of situations. Anyhow, definitely ask for it in writing, do not accept that they are right - they could be scamming as they appear to be in my brother's case.


Edited by: SASSISPRING at: 8/13/2009 (12:35)

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8/13/09 11:34 A

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I heard about these collection agencies and what they do. I would be hanging up on the person myself. I have enough stress knowing what my bills are, I don't need someone yelling at me about them. I pay what I can and if they can't deal with that that is their problem. I have contacted some myself and told them that pymt is on its way and I am caught up. Fortunately, I haven't had to deal with the collection agencies. I read a book called Debt Cures by Kevin Trudeau (I think that was the author) and there are are state time limitations on debt. I don't know about Canada. If it was a debt you "paid" off or the cc company wrote off and it still gets sold to these collection agencies. Tell them you don't know anything about it and would like something in writing so you could take a look at it yourself. Or just time them that x amount of time has past according to law and I don't owe that anymore. I found it interesting. I also found Ohio has one of the longest time limitations in the US...boo!!

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SASSISPRING's Photo SASSISPRING Posts: 11,077
8/12/09 1:26 P

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Just a little information on collection agencies that take over the file from a credit card company.

These companies are in the business of profit. They purchase these outstanding files from credit card companies. They are not paid unless they collect, therefore, if you are only paying $30 per month, they are not recieving their bottom line profit. They buy the files on the hopes that the threat will make people pay off the bills immediately - for that bottom line profit. They will do whatever has to be done to ensure that they make the most profit, including lying, yelling and threats.

Since it's gone to collections you are now in the Credit Bureau and are considered a high risk for future credit. Technically the file should be removed after 7yrs, however, it doesn't always happen and to get it removed is very difficult. And every time that you are late - which you haven't been - it is noted on the file and extends the life, even if it is 24hrs late. As a result, I have been at R9 credit rating (the worst in Canada) since 1990.

I learned about the underhanded tactics of these agencies (further) through my credit counsellor. When my cards were assumed by the counsellor, there was a two month period of time dealing with the paperwork, so technically he hadn't fully assumed them. As a result, VISA sold my file to the collection agency who contacted me and made blatent threats, along with lies. I contacted the counsellor, who contacted the agency and he was even threatened and lied to. Since he has the legal power to override them, he dealt with it, then told me to "answer the phone, say you need to get a pen and paper to write down the information and put the phone on the bed, don't hang up for at least a hour." (I don't have call display, couldn't avoid the call) So even with all the laws, he still couldn't legally stop them from calling me until VISA signed off my file. It's frustrating.

There used to be laws protecting consumers, including hours they can call, the days, what can and cannot be used, it seems to have gone to the wayside with the shuffling of Consumer and Corporate Affairs.

By the way, all agents will say that you are the absolute worst and that "people like you are the reason this country is in trouble." Its standard. What makes me laugh hard is my bff's son was one of those people......and he was also in heavy debt, recieving calls from collection agencies!! LOL!!!

He used to laugh so hard that here he was calling folks (he didn't threaten, said he could care less if they paid or not, he just did his job and was paid hourly - some are paid on commission) to pay their bills, while at home, his phone was filling up with the same calls. He didn't last there long, got a better job. Too funny though eh!



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GOBUTTS's Photo GOBUTTS Posts: 1,513
8/12/09 1:01 P

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I have one card that went to a collection agencies ... I was told that when it gets there that the credit card ... (MASTERCARD CANADIAN TIRE) was paid off and I had to pay the collection company ... they charge no interest so I send them 30$ a month ...

A lady called me and yelled at me and wouldn't let me say a word and was very rude so I hung up on her ...

She wanted me to pay 300 a month ... I told her she was crazy ... I couldn't pay that and she kept on yelling saying my kind of people are whats the problem ...

She called back another day and did the same thing ... when I asked her if I could talk she wouldn't shut up so I hung up ...

She even threatened me to get paid from my paychecks .. she hasseled me at work and was very rude on the phone ... so I hung up ...

My daughter told her I didn't want to talk to her so to ask someone else to call in her place ... I guess when they saw that I paid every month they quit calling ...

I send 30$ each month and don't miss a month ... they can't do anything as long as I send something ...



Edited by: GOBUTTS at: 8/12/2009 (13:07)
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SASSISPRING's Photo SASSISPRING Posts: 11,077
8/12/09 10:55 A

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There isn't any logic to it at all, imo.



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WEB_GIRL's Photo WEB_GIRL Posts: 1,211
8/12/09 9:21 A

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I know what you mean about credit card companies. I paid paid off one of my credit cards with a company but I still had another one through them. They lowered the credit limit on the card I paid off and then they raised the interest rate on the one I still owed on. When I asked them about it, they said "President Obama wanted them to be more fiscally responsible" so they were cutting credit limits on cards and raising interest on them also. I tried to get them to lower the limit and they said they could not. I even went to their supervisor and they said no.

I don't understand why they want to do that to hold people back. Seems like they would be willing to lower the rates to make sure people could pay their bills. I would rather lower the rates and have people pay the bill instead of raising the rates and having to write off the debt because someone could not pay. No logic with some companies, I guess.

Rhonda

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SASSISPRING's Photo SASSISPRING Posts: 11,077
8/11/09 11:41 P

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The good news is that up here, at least when a credit counsellor becomes involved, it all gets sorted out pretty fast. :)



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8/11/09 10:13 P

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Sorry to hear about that.

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SASSISPRING's Photo SASSISPRING Posts: 11,077
8/11/09 10:07 P

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There isn't a hardship dept. At least not here in Canada. You deal with who you deal with and they don't care. They will only take one serious from my experiences if one has excellent credit to begin with, otherwise you are out on your own. As for dropping them, they don't care - seriously. I don't have any open accounts and even back then I shut them down myself. That didn't change anything. The increasing interest has been an issue here for a long time even discussed in Parliment. It just is what it is, frustrating.



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8/11/09 7:52 P

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I've only had one credit card company that was rude with me, needless to say I dropped them like a hot potato! Others I have not hand any issues with them. Try asking for the hardship department. They may make a deal with you, but you will have to close out your card. I figure it didn't hurt me to do that because I hadn't used the card in a year since it had been suspended by the company.

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SASSISPRING's Photo SASSISPRING Posts: 11,077
8/11/09 7:32 P

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My experiences with talking to credit card companies and that of my brother and friends is the same - they do not work with a person and in fact, raise the interest. They are mean, they put a person down and they don't listen. You end up dealing with a different person every time and even when you ask for a specific person, you are not given that person. And when you already have bad credit rating, its impossible to deal with them. They refuse to deal with a person. My sister'n'law said to one company - "you can't threaten me, just come take the car" and the company did, reluctantly. They refused to talk with her and sort things out. Yet they didn't want the car as everyone was turning them in. Or like with hydro, where they added on more and more costs, my sister'n'law said "fine, you don't want to deal with me, the bottom line, you can't get money from a stone, this is all I can do, take it or cut off the hydro." They didn't cut off hydro and accepted the partial payment.

The only time I recall someone getting somewhere was my bff. She contacted the truck company - her husband is self-owner of a logging truck - and informed that due to the downturn in logging, they were struggling. The company stated straight out they were not repossing the trucks, they didn't want the owners to drop off the trucks (turn them in) because they simply didn't have room for all the trucks. Therefore, just pay what you can, even if its only dollars and pay when the work picks up.

That was something ages back and now, well, they simply won't work with people like that anymore.

I think its great when someone finds companies that'll work with them but its simply never been my experience. THat's why I had to go to a credit counsellor - the companies listen to them, not me.





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8/11/09 5:59 P

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Have you talked to the credit card companies to see if they will lower your rate. Never hurts to ask!!! I have to call one of mine back, they told me to make at least 3 pymts on time and they will look at it. That should be next month, but I am going to call sooner!

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SASSISPRING's Photo SASSISPRING Posts: 11,077
8/11/09 2:11 P

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To make the interest lower, you have to not only double up the payment, you have to triple it. Otherwise what you are doing is paying off that month's interest plus a bit on the principal. To truly make the interest cut, one has to really stand on one's head and do the impossible. What is your highest interest rate as that'll make a difference too. Mine had all climbed to 30%, one was 20%. Therefore, I really had to triple payments to even dent it. If its less, then double will work because at the least, you are paying off both at once.

Sounds like you do have a good grip on this, good for you.



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GOBUTTS's Photo GOBUTTS Posts: 1,513
8/11/09 2:09 P

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You said it ... the interest kills ... I try to pay more than the interest and more so that at least the next bill the interest is lower ...

I'm going to do it .... 170 ... look out here I come !!!


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SASSISPRING's Photo SASSISPRING Posts: 11,077
8/11/09 2:04 P

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That's terrific you don't have to pay the mechanic bill upfront. My parents help me out when I can't afford the bill as I can't do that. So good that the owner is allowing this.

My suggestion is to pay normal on the interest free debt and look at the debt with the highest interest, then double that one. Interest kills. When I went to the credit counsellor I said that I was paying over and over and over yet the bills kept increasing without my using the cards. She totalled the interest and with all seriousness, said that it would take about 50yrs to clear the debt, as the interest was compounding faster than I could pay. She said this is very common and how these companies continue to sit in profit while others around are falling down in debt. I said its legal loan sharking and she agreed.

So definitely, pay off the one with the high interest or it'll eat you alive.





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8/11/09 1:34 P

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Thanks for all the different ways to this ... This is really something ... the one I'm doubling up on is interest free ... maybe I should just pay it normal and put the extra on another ... but now I'm going to have to look at everything again ... my car just got out of the garage ... 700$ bill ... but the owner is someone I know and will let me pay what I can ... so that helps ... so here Igo again ... unsure ...

Edited by: GOBUTTS at: 8/11/2009 (13:37)
I'm going to do it .... 170 ... look out here I come !!!


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8/10/09 8:21 P

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I've always been told to also if you can pay the minimum, also pay at least the finance charge along with it. Just like said, she paid above what was due. I try, but not always can I do that.

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SASSISPRING's Photo SASSISPRING Posts: 11,077
8/10/09 6:28 P

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I agree with Sophie. I'd make the judgement call on the one with the highest interest.

Those payments, are those the double amounts or ordinary? If ordinary, the interest must be super low or are you simply paying off the interest?

When I used to pay individually on cards I would pay at least $50 over the interst if I couldn't afford the entire payment - as many were up in the hundreds of dollars range for one month. If I couldn't do that, I'd pay at the least $10 over interest. Otherwise all you are doing is paying interest -you probably know that.

It's good that you are able to do this and stay above water. I'm assuming that you are still making payments on the others while you double up right?

As for advice, the bank financial person told my brother to pick the lowest owing, pay off that one and keep moving on. Then he returned to inform her that is what he did and she had a "fit." Said that is not what one is to do, one is to pay on all of them, the amounts requested and not double up on one while paying minimum on another. He left in frustration. So who knows what the "true advice" is.



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8/10/09 5:54 P

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If they are credit cards, I would go with the highest interest rate first. If it is a bill that doesn't charge interest, then I would pay the smallest one of first. Once a bill is paid off, I would use that amount I was paying and apply it to the next bill and so on....

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8/10/09 2:58 P

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I think it's a personal choice. I went with the highest interest rate and when that one is paid will go to the next highest interest rate, but the 3 credit card I'm working on are closed accounts.

Great job on the healthy living and weight loss.

Make this a Healthy Choice Day!
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8/10/09 2:45 P

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Wishing you luck! I've heard both of those theories, too.

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WEB_GIRL's Photo WEB_GIRL Posts: 1,211
8/10/09 12:32 P

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I am interested to see the comments. I have heard two different things on paying off credit cards. 1. Pay off the smallest amount first, then apply that amount to the next smallest and so on. 2. Pay off the card with the highest interest rate.

Good luck and keep on keeping on!

Rhonda

'Nothing tastes as good as being thin feels'!

The pursuit of happiness is the chase of a lifetime! It is never too late to become what I might have been.

How I have felt: Fell off the wagon, got run over by the wagon and then it backed up and got me again!


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GOBUTTS's Photo GOBUTTS Posts: 1,513
8/10/09 11:57 A

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I have been doubling up on a small payment to clear it up ... I have 400$ left to pay ... I am hoping to use that amount afterwards on another one ... But I don't know if its better to go to the next smallest one or a bigger one ...

I have three credit cards to clear up ... one at 2,500 ..... one at 1,500 and one at 1,300 .... I pay 88$ .. 30$ and 60$ ...

And also when I want to pay more ... something on my car breaks ... normal things that its time to happen ... so that takes my extras ,...

I have been keeping my head up and I know I will get out of this ... I'm taking it one day at a time and trying not to think negative ...

There will be a time that I make the final payment ... and I will rejoice ... lol ...

So mealwhile ... I'm here with you all and taking it all in ...

Patricia

I'm going to do it .... 170 ... look out here I come !!!


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