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TRAUMMAUS1291 SparkPoints: (16,826)
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1/25/14 6:46 A

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Oh dear, I just realized I posted my system in the wrong step 2. UPS!
I'll delet it as soon AS I'm done Heer.

Heer in germany WW went threw so many changes and programs. Right now it's the PP with easy quick start. No idea what that's about though.
I'm following a plan that came out in the mid 1990's called Erfolgsignale Plus. In a break down the foods you eat are grouped in the colors of a traffic light. Green is fruit and veggies and are unlimited, except underlined fruit should only be eaten once or twice a day because they are high in fruitsugar. The other catagorie is yellow, depending on your weight you get so many yellow, and you get 21 red a week, and you can trade 4 red for 1 yellow but not the other way around.
If you workout you can earn more red or yellow.
It's a neat system and when I first went to WW and used this I lost a good amount of weight.
But having my baby put most, but not all of it back on.
New it's difficult to figure out how many yellow new foods have. But it seems that calculating the german flex points for that food and halving it has been a good fix. I've lost 4 kilos so far on this system and I am satisfied.

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TRAUMMAUS1291 SparkPoints: (16,826)
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1/25/14 3:53 A

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Oh dear, I just realized I posted my system in the wrong step 2. UPS!
I'll delet it as soon AS I'm done Heer.

Heer in germany WW went threw so many changes and programs. Right now it's the PP with easy quick start. No idea what that's about though.
I'm following a plan that came out in the mid 1990's called Erfolgsignale Plus. In a break down the foods you eat are grouped in the colors of a traffic light. Green is fruit and veggies and are unlimited, except underlined fruit should only be eaten once or twice a day because they are high in fruitsugar. The other catagorie is yellow, depending on your weight you get so many yellow, and you get 21 red a week, and you can trade 4 red for 1 yellow but not the other way around.
If you workout you can earn more red or yellow.
It's a neat system and when I first went to WW and used this I lost a good amount of weight.
But having my baby put most, but not all of it back on.
New it's difficult to figure out how many yellow new foods have. But it seems that calculating the german flex points for that food and halving it has been a good fix. I've lost 4 kilos so far on this system and I am satisfied.

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AEMALE1 Posts: 2
8/11/13 11:18 A

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Julee, if you have the break down to the Freedom could you please post it on the message board and any other materials that you may have. The Freedom plan worked wonders for me. I was able to lose 50 lbs. But when points came out the weight crept back on. Would appreciate the info that you have.

DTOWERY1's Photo DTOWERY1 SparkPoints: (2,527)
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8/5/13 9:24 P

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I am so glad to see all of your posts for the old WW plans!! I lost 40 pounds on the Momentum Plan (I believe that's what it was called) several years ago and kept the weight off pretty good for a few years. Then....well....some major stresses in my life...divorce and a job change all at once. Anyway, I regained most of the weight back due to all of that stress and now have decided I've had enough. Although I am now unemployed (have been since January of this year), I am going back on Momentum. I have the old book/guide and even some old recipe books! I really had great success with it and when I tried the WW PP last year I gained on it!! Was really upset. So....it's back to WW Momentum Plan I go! So happy to see the support here!

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LEESA_LEESA SparkPoints: (6)
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5/29/12 4:24 A

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Going back to momentum/flex program. First day was yesterday and I am looking forward to weighing in a week!!

CHEESELY SparkPoints: (9)
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5/23/12 7:00 A

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Hi. I'm planning to go back on the WW Freedom Plan that I followed in the mid-90s. But I can't remember some key details. 1) There was a weekend plan option -- eat less during the week so you can splurge on the weekend, right? And 2) if you exercise more, you can eat more. But what was the formula? For every extra x minutes, you earn extra x bonus calories??? Can anybody help with these details? Thanks so much.


MARIPOSAGRRL Posts: 2
5/20/12 9:20 P

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I'm going back as well. I will use Spark and old materials. :)
Hope to chat with others here.

DEECAJUN SparkPoints: (145)
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5/1/12 3:16 P

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same thing happened to me, i gained my first week back! Going back to the old Point system today!


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MSJAEBEA's Photo MSJAEBEA SparkPoints: (101)
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4/15/12 1:43 A

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I have started back on Momentum. PPlus was awful! I was always hungry and cranky and no matter how hard I worked, the weight wouldn't come off. When I looked back into Momentum, I found plenty of stuff on the net for support. I was able to get my current points and have a link to a points calculator that I keep on my computer and my phone. I am not hungry anymore and feel great!

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Edited by: MSJAEBEA at: 4/15/2012 (01:44)
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LEARNINGTOHOOP Posts: 4
4/7/12 5:49 P

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I've gone back to exchanges too. I'm thinking about giving myself some Weekly Points as well - maybe 21. Are you doing that?

GAILRUU's Photo GAILRUU Posts: 9,887
3/29/12 10:35 P

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I actually managed to get in 8 glasses of water a day over the last week and to my surprise I lost 2.4 pounds! I don't usually drink water since I drink lots of coffee, but it seemed to help.

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THORNITA SparkPoints: (1,803)
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3/29/12 4:08 P

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I also am an online pp subscriber and feel the pp is not for me. So I have decided to start again next week on the vintage plan after weight in I decided to have an experiment today with the points and only at 21 pp even though I followed old system this I feel will work better for me as what not losing on pp.

GAILRUU's Photo GAILRUU Posts: 9,887
3/15/12 3:34 P

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I am a relapsed WW lifetime member and went back two weeks ago. The first week I lost 4.6 pounds but this week I gained a pound in spite of eating right and exercising. I am not actually discouraged since I actually gained a bit more and it is coming off. I expect it is water retention and by next week I will have a better result. I keep track of both calories and PP and I find I am actually doing better with keeping my diet in control since I have been doing WW. I felt I needed some incentive to get myself back on track and lose the ten pounds I gained last fall. I have less than 5 pounds to get back under my goal weight and I do hope to manage that by the first of April.

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CELTICMELODY's Photo CELTICMELODY Posts: 1,829
3/14/12 12:12 P

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I found even MORE exchange program materials last night!!! The weeks 1, 2, 3 preplanned menu. Looking it over, there is lots of stuff I like in there. I'm curious as to how it stacks up against Flex points. I think I'm going to try weeks 1 & 2 and keep track of both exchanges AND points just to see what it comes out to be!

Definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over expecting different results


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LISAANN777's Photo LISAANN777 SparkPoints: (1,168)
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1/13/12 11:35 A

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Hello Everyone! I have been doing the WW PP plan religiously, exercising, tracking etc. I stepped on the scale this morning and I gained 2 pounds. I'm done. I'm gonig back to the old WW points plan. Which means I have a daily allowance of 19 points and I have to count fruit. I must admit, I did like the free point fruit, but that is maybe what was getting me in trouble. Not sure. So back to the old plan I go. I can't wait to see if this will make a difference. And btw, here is a website that lists tons of restaurants with their menu options and the points vaules. It shows both the old points and the new points plus. I find it to be very helpful. http://www.dwlz.com/restaurants.html

SAO1950 Posts: 6
1/8/12 7:25 P

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I have the old Winning Points materials. Much difference in it and Momemtum?

HUNNNYBEE's Photo HUNNNYBEE Posts: 1,258
10/29/11 6:21 A

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DOMESTICDIVA76...I'm with you! I am so glad that I saved all of my old program information! And I am really appreciating my old WW cookbooks that list points from the Flex Plan, and not points from the new plan.

I know the old plan works. I'm sticking with it!

Change is not always better!
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Margaret

People are like stained glass windows: they sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light within.
~Elizabeth Kubler-Ross


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DOMESTICDIVA76's Photo DOMESTICDIVA76 SparkPoints: (7,118)
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10/28/11 10:16 P

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Was hoping this group would be a bit more active but gonna post anyway. I give up on the new points plus system. I'm going back to momentum. My ww.com subscription ran out yesterday and I was thankful. I just dug out all of my momentum books and have been reading through them/figuring my daily points/etc. I'm so happy that my whole grain light english muffin will be just 1 point again!

~Jen~

“It takes more courage to reveal insecurities than to hide them, more strength to relate to people than to dominate them, more 'manhood' to abide by thought-out principles rather than blind reflex. Toughness is in the soul and spirit, not in muscles and an immature mind.”
Alex Karras quotes







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CELTICMELODY's Photo CELTICMELODY Posts: 1,829
8/24/11 1:59 P

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You're welcome.

Yeah, ya know the thing that made me pick it up - apart fromt he fact that it was .50 LOL - was all this talk about eating in-season local veggies. And, the menu cookbook has a list of in-season veggies at the beginning of each month. I had forgotten all about that!!

WW was "green" before anyone else. Who knew?

Definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over expecting different results


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PARRGIRL's Photo PARRGIRL SparkPoints: (1,722)
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8/24/11 1:40 P

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Thanks CELTICMELODY for the reminder about the 365 day cookbook. I need to dig mine out and study it. I'm a cookbook junkie and have tons of them - not that I use them!

~Pam in California~

Out of the Mouths of Babes ~ words to remember and thoughts to work on:

"My stomach's not hungry, my mouth's hungry." ~ Zach, age 4

"Whenever we pass by here, my eyes make my tummy hungry." ~ Family Circus cartoon outside ice cream shop


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CELTICMELODY's Photo CELTICMELODY Posts: 1,829
8/24/11 11:55 A

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For those doing the old Freedom or Quick Start Exchange programs:

If you can't find old materials, try picking up one of the following old Weight Watchers books (both are listed on Amazon.)

Weight Watchers Quick Start Plus Program Cookbook by Jean Niditch
Weight Watchers New 365-Day Menu Cookbook:Complete Meals For Every Day of the Year

The WW Quick Start Plus Program Cookbook has an overview of the Quick Start Plus with the exhanges and how to use the optional calories.

The WW New 365-Day Menu Cookbook has one recipe a day for each day of the year and a complete day's menu for each day as well.

If you can find them both, terrific. I got mine at a library sale for .50 each.

Personally, I found points had a little TOO much freedom for me. I need the discipline of exchanges. Plus, I think using exchanges helps follow the government's new My Plate program.

Edited by: CELTICMELODY at: 8/24/2011 (12:03)
Definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over expecting different results


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PISCEANMOM's Photo PISCEANMOM Posts: 12
6/30/11 8:37 P

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My plan right now is to go back on Momentum, I've cancelled my WW membership. Momentum was the first WW plan I ever did and even though I didn't stick to it for very long (I was hardcore low carb) I was consistently surprised with the amount of weight I lost. I didn't even believe it would work and I lost 4lbs the first week. I've been searching the web for some resources for the old plan. I'd really like to get the pointsfinder slider but people want to charge crazy amounts for them even though they were free. Anyway, glad to have found this thread.

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RHEAVON's Photo RHEAVON SparkPoints: (2,274)
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6/30/11 10:12 A

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I just wanted to come over here after my intro post to say that I've decided to still be a meeting member, but follow Momentum.

I haven't talked to my leader about my change-over, but she seems like she would be a little more open than other leaders at the center to knowing I don't "Trust in the PP program." It is insane how militant some of the leaders are about PP at that center. Plus, I really do like the people in my meeting group.

I've figured I'd still keep my monthly pass since it is ~$9.22 a week as opposed to $13.00 for a meeting. Today will be my 79th+ time in the meeting room since starting this journey since I've been going 1-2 times a week, never missing a week's topic.

I've been transitioning back to Momentum for the past 2 weeks, trying to de-wire my brain from PP. My plan is to "zone out" PP talk and stay for support (giving and receiving), topics for living better, and get some ideas that I can cross-check with Points values to see if they would be good choices for me.

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HUNNNYBEE's Photo HUNNNYBEE Posts: 1,258
6/28/11 5:51 A

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Hi TAWVRY!

First off...CONGRATULATIONS on getting into the 120's! WooHOO! Excellent!

I don't like counting calories either! I still count by points (also by the really old "exchange" system of WW). I track on paper...I made a sheet that allows me to count the points and exchanges. 99% of the time, the points and exchanges add up the same.

I like the exchanges, because they help me to keep it all balanced. With the points alone, I tend to lean a bit heavy on the carbs!
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I like your idea of making your own database with calories/points! I am a big believer in tailoring a program to suit your needs & lifestyle!

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Margaret

People are like stained glass windows: they sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light within.
~Elizabeth Kubler-Ross


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TAWVRY's Photo TAWVRY Posts: 53
6/25/11 2:32 P

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Hi Hunnybee!

I defintely am familiar with the Spark website, and I love it! Like I said, I do prefer counting points over calories, mostly since I also plan to track my APs and eat half of them (it worked for me last time on old WW)

However I am still using Spark to look up calories before I put them in my WW spreadsheet and am slowly building my own WW calories/points database. That's a good idea to use the recipe builder in Spark though, since I of course don't have my own for WW using just Excel.

And I'm also going to continue using Spark to track my weight and measurements, as well as use the forum for support!

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HUNNNYBEE's Photo HUNNNYBEE Posts: 1,258
6/25/11 7:02 A

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Hi TAWVRY!
Don't feel guilty for replacing a plan that doesn't work for you! With weight-loss and fitness, one size does not fit all! Finding the plan/program that works for you is key.
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Have you had a chance to explore the Spark website? Most of the tools that were available with WW, are also available on Spark. I use the trackers and the recipe builder most often, but once you get used to navigating around the Spark website, I think you might not miss the WW tools when they expire.

One thing I love about Spark...you can find support any day...any time. It's like having a meeting available in your own home!

Wishing you success on your journey!

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Edited by: HUNNNYBEE at: 6/25/2011 (07:03)
Margaret

People are like stained glass windows: they sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light within.
~Elizabeth Kubler-Ross


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TAWVRY's Photo TAWVRY Posts: 53
6/25/11 4:00 A

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Hi everyone, I'm new here and wanted to share my story/plan.

I did the old plan a few years ago and lost 22 lb on it in a few months (about 2-3lb loss per month, except for a 2-week-long plateau I broke through by eating more APs) but of course I failed to maintain it. This past Winter I gained a LOT of weight to reach my heighest weight ever, and began on SparkPeople on 5/1/11. I lost about 10lb on it in about a month and a week, then joined WW P+ because I hate counting calories. I only lost the first week and now have been plateauing or gaining for almost 3 weeks. This past week I started counting fruit and cutting down to 27 out of 29 points, and that might be working but I'm still sick of P+. So starting today I'm switching to the old WW plan. I canceled my P+ account today as well (I felt so guilty and sad about it!), although I get access to the tools until September.

Also, I want to mention that I excercise quite a lot (on a typical week I do 8 hours of varied cardio and 3 hours of strength and core training)

So in summary my plan is:
WW Old plan (Momentum I think, or maybe it's Flex?)
Daily Points: 19
I will eat half of my AP's every day (this worked for me last time I officially did the old plan)
I will not eat my 35 weeklies unless some special occasion arises

I'm using the following spreadsheet I found online:
https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=
0AjCxNQjKIQuqcmtmS2JxaEFMaHNpUm95SFlBe
nZmOUE&hl=en&authkey=CMG32agJ#gid=0


Edited by: TAWVRY at: 6/25/2011 (13:59)
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KNIT1PURL2LOSE3's Photo KNIT1PURL2LOSE3 Posts: 745
6/21/11 5:08 P

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I posted the second installment of my detailed report of the thin commandments book.

havingfunandlosingweight.blogspot.co
m/
2011/06/chapter-1-strategy-is-strongR>er-than.html


I think reading this book is helping shift some of my perceptions. Yay!

This is not a journey to weight loss; it is a journey about choosing life one day at a time.


"Don't take a clock on this journey, take a compass. It's the direction you're moving in that matters, not the time it takes you to get there." - Anonymous



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KNIT1PURL2LOSE3's Photo KNIT1PURL2LOSE3 Posts: 745
6/21/11 2:48 P

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Wow. Either the scale is completely broken, or I've dropped a total of 8.4 lbs in the past 6 days! Now, 6 of those lbs were a regain from a long staycation the first 12 days of June, although I'm surprised those 6 came off so easily and quickly! But this morning's scale news was a total shocker: another 2.4 lbs since yesterday morning! I'm going to have to double check that scale.

It's very nice to be off that silly merry-go-round that the new WW plan had me on. I don't know what it was about that thing. I never even ate all my points, and after the initial 10 lb drop, I just circled the wagons. Switching things up every few weeks seems to be working really well for me. Plus this book, the Thin Commandments Diet by Gullo is helping, and I'm not even finished with it, nor am I following Gullo's diet, which is way in the back after 175 pages of strategies and tips! I think I'm just starting to look at food differently now. That's not something I got from WW.

But, I need to be careful, because this, too, shall pass. That scale will stop moving, or go the wrong way, all too quickly. For now, I am very content with what and how I am eating, and I'll stay with it as long as it works and change it when it stops.

I'm just so happy to have found this group, and know that I am not alone nor am I crazy, that the new WW plan just isn't meant for every body. finding what DOES work can be so elusive and/or short-lived, but this group gave me the courage to experiment. woo hoo!

This is not a journey to weight loss; it is a journey about choosing life one day at a time.


"Don't take a clock on this journey, take a compass. It's the direction you're moving in that matters, not the time it takes you to get there." - Anonymous



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LYSADELL's Photo LYSADELL SparkPoints: (31,105)
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6/20/11 2:56 P

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I re-purchased (from E-bay) the Momentum books. I am so unhappy with points plus, I've been within the same 5 - 7 lbs since January. Momentum worked for me.

I think that WW knows the Points Plus program either needs to be tweaked or b'bye!

Rather than aiming for being perfect, just aim to be little bit better today than you were yesterday.

Cookie dough ice cream each day keeps the skinny jeans away!

- - Lysa


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HUNNNYBEE's Photo HUNNNYBEE Posts: 1,258
6/17/11 9:27 P

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KNIT1PURL2LOSE3....I will keep you posted, and let you know if I like the book! I am going to share it with my friend at work....we work at a library, and are always checking out the books that offer tips on controlling weight.

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Edited by: HUNNNYBEE at: 6/17/2011 (21:28)
Margaret

People are like stained glass windows: they sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light within.
~Elizabeth Kubler-Ross


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KNIT1PURL2LOSE3's Photo KNIT1PURL2LOSE3 Posts: 745
6/17/11 10:27 A

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Hey Hunnybee! I'll be interested to know how you like the book! I'm underlining every few paragraphs, LOL!

I'm also thrilled that another 2 of the 6lb regain has dropped off, leaving me at just 1 lb over what I was prior to the 9-day eat-out-everyday-staycation! So, I'm back on track and feeling great! I have so much more energy and so much less pain yesterday and today!! That's HUGE!

I just don't think it's possible for me to lose weight by eating out more than once or twice a week. Even being careful, it's tough. Restaurants just love to load up the fat and sugar and more fat and low fiber carbs! and I just can't bear the thought of paying $10 for a salad! LOL!

But, I'm back on my schedule and doing well, and looking forward to blogging about Gullo's book next week......

How's everyone doing??? Have a great weekend!

This is not a journey to weight loss; it is a journey about choosing life one day at a time.


"Don't take a clock on this journey, take a compass. It's the direction you're moving in that matters, not the time it takes you to get there." - Anonymous



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HUNNNYBEE's Photo HUNNNYBEE Posts: 1,258
6/17/11 6:32 A

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Hi KNIT1PURL2LOSE3!
Thanks for the info on "The Thin Commandments"! I just requested a copy from my library!
emoticon

Like you, I left WW (although it was quite some time ago!). i have found incredible support with Spark. I like Spark, because I can connect with people any time I want to...and not have to wait for a meeting! :)

emoticon

Margaret

People are like stained glass windows: they sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light within.
~Elizabeth Kubler-Ross


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KNIT1PURL2LOSE3's Photo KNIT1PURL2LOSE3 Posts: 745
6/16/11 11:14 A

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Good going to so many of you!!! Yay!!

I officially terminated my WW membership. I wasn't able to get to meetings regularly, and of course didn't need the isn't-the-new-plan-fantastic pep talks anyway, since the new plan just was not working for me. I figure I can use that $40 a month more productively. Plus, I am feeling that I no longer need that meeting to hold myself accountable, between Spark and my personal weight loss blog, and this group, I think I'm good.

Last week the Sweetie was on staycation all week, which completely took me off plan as we ate out every day. Of course that resulted in a 6 lb re-gain, but as of this morning, I am down 3 of those 6 lbs. So I'm doing something right and headed in the right direction!

I want to recommend a book to read: The Thin Commandments by Gullo (NOT the one by Costin!). 75% of the book is all about different strategies to use, and they are GREAT! I had read the book from my library a few years ago, took copious notes, but of course promptly forgot all the great techniques a few months later. So during the staycation, I found it new at a store for 99cents. I picked it up and I've been re-reading it, and remembering why I liked it so much.

Of course, if you don't want to buy the book, I'll be blogging about his strategies over the next few weeks, so you can glean the best of it that way. But it has inspired me again that i CAN and I WILL do this, one step at a time!

Hope everyone is having a fantastic day!

This is not a journey to weight loss; it is a journey about choosing life one day at a time.


"Don't take a clock on this journey, take a compass. It's the direction you're moving in that matters, not the time it takes you to get there." - Anonymous



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FUNKYMOMMY's Photo FUNKYMOMMY Posts: 2,513
6/13/11 6:39 P

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I have also turned my back on PP.. I am finding the points are just to much.. I have dropped 13lb by going back to the old Momentum plan.This one works better for me.

Cheers all!
Deb

One Dream at a Time. Step by Step






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TALLEYSGRL's Photo TALLEYSGRL Posts: 1,220
5/26/11 4:25 A

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You'll be so happy you did SparkleGirl! I lost 7 lbs since going back on it a month ago, and I seriously had been losing and regaining the same 4 lbs since Nov. When I hit -4 lbs back on Momentum, I expected it to come back on, but now its -7. I actually feel like Im eating more and wanting less now too, weird, seeing as I lost points and am counting my fruit. Just so happy with it!

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SPARKLEGIRL59's Photo SPARKLEGIRL59 SparkPoints: (0)
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4/25/11 4:00 P

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I'm going back to Momentum. This is Week 1, Day 1.

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4/25/11 3:13 P

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The plan I am going back to is the "Freedom Plan". You have 5-6 breads, 6-7 Proteins and 3-4 fats ea day and bonus calories of 250 calories a day. It teaches you by sight and portion size what to eat and how much to eat. People were losing weight like crazy at the time of this plan and maybe that was a problem for weight watchers as far as keeping people coming back weekly. I truly believe I would have kept the 30# I lost off if I didn't have to switch over to points. All the food products and anything with weight watchers had everything easily figured out for me and then points came on the scene and it just became very very difficult trying to figure out fats, proteins and breads, but now I am ready to do this plan again after being so aggravated and disappointed with points and the lack of assistance and all...weight watchers hands over the materials and pretty much sends you out on your own....

Edited by: JULEE12363 at: 4/25/2011 (15:15)
CELTICGIRL30 SparkPoints: (0)
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4/25/11 11:08 A

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Hi Everyone,

I am a disillusioned WW Lifetime member. As of last week, I officially gave up on the P+ plan. I can't say how well returning to Flex/Momentum has worked out for me yet (Easter weekend threw a HUGE wrench in my diet plans), but I hope to find out over the next month.

It is nice to know I am not the only one who struggled with the P+ plan. I am happy that there are some who can work it successfully, but I am not one of them. And I, too, resent being made to feel like that is solely my fault. When I am not honest with myself, I expect to run into trouble. But I gave this plan a real shot, was careful with points, and still had nothing to show for it on the scale or in the way my clothes fit.

I already was beginning to feel that I was spinning out of control. I was struggling with maintanence and was paying each month for being 5 lbs over my WW goal. I thought perhaps the new plan would feel like a new diet, a new challenge, and it would jump start my motivation. In a way, it did. I was recalculating and learning the new points. I was eating different foods, eating more fruits (2 per day, which I never ate on the old plan), veg, and proteins, etc. After 4 months of P+, currently I am 8 lbs over my WW goal and 11 lbs over my personal goal. I'm done.

Hopefully, this will be my new jump start. I am determined to prove myself right that the old plan works best for me. I intend to follow strictly, as I did when I first started the process. I will weigh, measure, count, and anything else I need to do. By next month, I hope to have at least 4 lbs gone. Either way, I will feel better emotionally having returned to the plan where I felt most at home and had the most success.

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4/25/11 10:03 A

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The old plan that worked for me was the Weight Watchers "Freedom Plan", This was an exchange based program that I was very very successful with and kept the weight off for a long time. Then, WWr's decided to change over to points system. Almost over night I could see the weight creeping slowly back on me. I had a very hard time doing points. and a lot of the people that were as successful as I was with the "Freedom plan" were also having problems. Thank God I kept all my materials(aside from the journals) from back then. I have been trying the Points plus too, but after losing and gaining the same 4 pounds over 3 months, I have decided to go back to the way that worked for me. I really wish Weight Watchers would give the members the option of continuing the use of the programs that worked for them and introducing the newer programs as an option.
It's so strange to me that when these new programs come on the scene, all the food packaging and snacks and products that WW'rs promotes and sells, quickly remove any and all traces of any previous programs, like we are supposed to immediatley erase and forget whats working for us at the time, in order to continue to be weight watcher members andt conform to the newer plans. They just don't have any members backs, unless of course you are Jennifer Hudson...who btw,did not lose all her weight with just Weight Watchers....if anyone comes across a journal from the "Freedom Plan" circa, 1997, please let me know....anyone else want to join me on my journey, please let me know too! emoticon

Edited by: JULEE12363 at: 4/25/2011 (10:09)
SHARILEE_OHIO's Photo SHARILEE_OHIO SparkPoints: (32,442)
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4/24/11 8:49 P

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Welcome GOING4GOAL1. I just went back to Momentum myself, lost two weeks in a row, that never happened with PP.

Pounds lost since July 2010: 48

Pounds to reach goal: 14.0

"Bad habits are like a comfortable bed, easy to get into, but hard to get out of" (unknown)

"Energy and persistence conquer all things" (Benjamin Franklin)




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GOING4GOAL1 Posts: 1
4/22/11 6:43 A

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So very glad I found this TEAM...thanks to Lori....I have been struggling with PP...just can't seem to get with that program. So it's back to Momentum for me. Today will be my first official day. I have been very successful with WW on Core and orginally Winning Pts. I look forward to being part of the TEAM and look foward to all the support and motivation I have read here this morning. Any in put, tips,and info on Momentum would be appreciated. I believe I have week one booklet and week 6. I do have the CFC and DO books as well.
So wish me luck...have a wonderful day today. and Happy Holiday.


KGIRL_ROCKS Posts: 11
4/21/11 10:29 P

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Debra, I think you hit the nail on the head. Many others have stated they feel they same way. I really dislike and disagree with WW's approach that we are resistant to change, etc.

I'm back on Momentum starting tomorrow morning after gaining 8 lbs on Points Plus. Will post back to see how things go.

PS- I'm really grateful for this group. emoticon

WILDERNESS2SEE's Photo WILDERNESS2SEE SparkPoints: (318)
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4/21/11 7:43 P

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Sunny, thanks for the reference. I may check that group out too. I think when I started in 2008, what we were doing was called Flex. Frankly, Momentum has seemed like the same program with only a few points values changed.

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SUNNYBLUESKIES1 Posts: 64
4/21/11 7:38 P

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That team is called Weightwatchers Momentum by the way!

SUNNYBLUESKIES1 Posts: 64
4/21/11 7:36 P

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I found a small group of people doing the old program if anyone is doing Flex/Momentum and wants to join in to support one another. I just posted on it that I tripletracked today. On Flex and I assume Momentum I came in at 22 and got all my GHG's. Interestingly enough I also hit 22 PP if I were doing Points Plus and that was with 3 fruits (actually 6 servings). If I were 'following' that plan, I could eat another 7 PP and fruit/vegetables too! If I were doing Core, I have used 4 points for non-core food and I could eat any Core food to satisfaction if hungry. Having only 22 points has made me weigh and measure everything and be really careful with my choices. I didn't do all that well with Momentum last year but after all I have been through and regaining at least 6 pounds, I am ready to go back to what got me to goal in the first place and that is the Flex Plan. I had good success with the Old Core Plan, so in my triple tracking, I just may make the leap back to that, but for now weighing and measuring and being super careful is a good thing.

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4/21/11 5:18 P

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I'm on Momentum, the program I lost my weight and got to Lifetime on. I know it works and I don't like the point penalization for the carbs. That is why I'm not certain that I will go back to Points Plus, even if Weight Watchers alters the amount of points suggested to certain individuals. I know that it will get harder as the years pass by since info in the Dining Out Guide will become more and more dated on Momentum. However, I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. For now, I've got to take off the weight I put on, mostly due to my own behavior, over the last few months.

Wish I knew the answer to the McDonald's ice cream question. I know that in the Dining Out Guide, there is a value given for a Jr. ice cream cone and then a regular low-fat ice cream cone. I've never seen anything but one size cone at our local McDonald's, no matter what the guide says. I presuming it's the regular low-fat ice cream cone.

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MONGO2TEN's Photo MONGO2TEN Posts: 10,883
4/18/11 12:39 P

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Curious about the MacDonald's ice cream. What should it be?

~Nancy



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HIPFAN01 SparkPoints: (469)
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4/18/11 12:37 P

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I'm also finding weird points issues - for example, if I went to Wendy's on the old plan, I'd usually order a plain baked potato. On PointsPlus, a small order of fries is the same points as a plain potato. While common sense tells me to order the plain potato, I'm more tempted to order the fries than I would have been on the old plan :)

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DEBRA5552000 SparkPoints: (2,896)
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4/18/11 6:47 A

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I like how the people at WW assume that if you don't like Points Plus it's because you are "resistant to change" and the "anxiety of change." (Spare me) Also the insulting patronizing that some long time weight watcher's members do not have the emotional dexterity to adapt to a new and better plan.
Awesome customer service WW. Way to listen.

They aren't listening when people tell them they aren't losing on Points Plus.
The only thing they will listen to is declining sales figures and that will take a while to register with them.

This is an organization that has a marketing department unethical enough to assign lower points to some brand named foods. The 3 point McDonalds Ice Cream Cone is a riot.



HUNNNYBEE's Photo HUNNNYBEE Posts: 1,258
4/17/11 8:24 A

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I agree with you HIPFAN01...part of the key to a successful weight loss program is finding one that works for you! It is NOT one-size-fits-all!

The last time I attended WW, there was a choice of Flex Points or Core Plan. At that time, I was happy to see that they seemed to be working with people to offer a choice of which plan worked more efficiently for individuals.

I have gone back to the old program from the late 1980's. Like you said, if it doesn't work, it's because I didn't follow it!

emoticon

Margaret

People are like stained glass windows: they sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light within.
~Elizabeth Kubler-Ross


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4/16/11 8:08 P

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I'm also a member who struggled with PointsPlus - I think, for some reason, it's starting to kick in, but am upset with WW for a couple of reasons. First, and most importantly, I don't like the way it's implied that we must be doing something wrong if PP isn't working for us. Weight loss is not a one size fits all thing (no pun intended) and the beauty of Momentum is it did give up options. As a WW member on and off for a long time, I think that some of the older plans were more effective than PointsPlus. At least, IMHO, if the plan failed, it was because I chose not to follow it. It was frustrating to spend 3 months following a plan as written and not see results.

I'm glad to have found this group, even when I am using PointsPlus, this seems to be a hugely supportive group, regardless of which plan you choose to follow :)

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LINJUBAR SparkPoints: (0)
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4/13/11 7:43 P

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I'm on Vintage Points, (VP) which is the former UK Discovery Plan before PP. It has a different formula than Momentum, but the points for most of the foods I eat are the same as Momentum, with just a few small differences. I get 21 points with no WP, but find that falls far short of the calorie goal on SP. Still I eat my 21 points, and know I can have so many more calories/points if I want. Similar to having points in the bank or weeklies.

I joined the VP group today based in the UK and they were so friendly, and gave me a warm welcome. I don't go to the WW message boards for support now because after my last post on the PP board, well I just don't want to deal with all the snarky comments.

I lost 1lb on my first half week on VP, (which is technically Momentum) after a stall of almost 2.5 months on PP. I like this plan, and hope it continues to like me!



LAURAS-B Posts: 666
4/13/11 3:37 P

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I am still doing PP but with some tweaking. If this doesn't work I am going back to the first points system 1-2-3 Success! I lost all of my weight on it and was doing it when the programs changed each time. I didn't like Momentum, a mind set I think, but loved 1-2-3 Success!

I just weighed in for the 5th month on PP (started when it rolled out) and I have pretty much stayed the same after gaining 3 pounds on the plan. This weight will not leave. My clothes are looser but come on, when does it show up on the scale???

Thanks for creating this board. Have a great day!

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SWEETROSIE2's Photo SWEETROSIE2 SparkPoints: (12,234)
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3/31/11 8:02 A

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Great letter, I also am doing the old points, but as I am from Australia (but living in Saudi) my points for a lot of food are different I brought all my material here with me so that is good for me.
They don't have WW here and I found the online for PP hard to do.
There is a girl on this site GENERAL TEAM DISCUSSION FORUM called Juliane and she wrote a post on how to find the points for momentum. Maybe her post will help you.
All the best to you and I hope this helps.

Rosie Perth Australia (living in Saudi Arabia)


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KALOLA11's Photo KALOLA11 SparkPoints: (0)
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3/30/11 9:47 P

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Thanks, SweetRosie! Wow, you're a long way away. I appreciate the support!

"Just keep swimming, just keep swimming..."


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3/30/11 9:46 P

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Thanks for the welcome, girl! We're very close to the same weight, too. Happy to be here. I think it's just the ticket for me right now!

"Just keep swimming, just keep swimming..."


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3/30/11 9:31 P

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Thought I'd share this exchange with WW "Customer Service" (start at bottom)

Dear Claudia,

Thanks for your reply. At least part of this “small group of struggling members” has found a new home on SparkPeople. It’s grown from 333 to 442 in less than 24 hours.

I think we just want to have options. It’s feels very “big brother” of WW to have made this major change and taken away tools that work for us. I look forward to your PDF, but in the meantime, I beg you: Give me back my Momentum e-tools options. Believe me, I’ve struggled with my weight for years and years. I finally found a solution that works and you’ve taken it away with no seemingly regard for individuals.

I’ve been a HUGE advocate for Weight Watcher’s since 2008. Please help me keep my faith in you.

From: Plan Manager Support [mailto:PlanManagerSupport@weightwatchers.
com]
Subject: Re: Help: Plan Manager [#28535347]

Dear Carol,

Thank you for contacting Weightwatchers.com.

We understand change is exciting for some, difficult or anxiety-provoking for others. Especially when you’ve been successful doing the previous program. Over the last 47 years we have been in the forefront of the most successful weight loss programs. We urge you to give it a try. Weight Watchers PointsPlus™ is our very best program yet – based on the latest science and research.

Although you are free to follow any previous plan that you wish, you should know that our meetings rooms and website will only support Watchers PointsPlus at this time.

Visit http://www.weightwatchers.com/util/art/ind
ex_art.aspx?tabnum=1&art_id=104221 for some helpful information regarding your transition to PointsPlus.


We understand how difficult it is to adjust to new plans and systems: relearning new PointsPlus values, making different food choices - even learning to use the term "PointsPlus"!

We knew this would be a big change for our members, and making this switch was not a decision we took lightly. However we felt an obligation to our members to keep up with the latest science; we can already see the change is showing great results for the vast majority of our customers. We are aware that this information does not help your situation, and we sincerely want to help you achieve your goals.

We are working on preparing materials to help the small group of dedicated but struggling members who are having a hard time losing weight on the PointsPlus program. We plan to have this ready as an Adobe PDF file very soon which we can send you by Email.

If you would like to receive this guide, please let us know by reply, and we will add your Email address to a list to send it out as soon as the file is ready.

Sincerely,
Claudia
Customer Service Associate
www.weightwatchers.com

--Original Message--
From: CAROLCAIN
Subject: Help: Plan Manager

Questions: I just want to register my dissatisfaction with the way you handled the new Points Plus introduction. I don't feel that it's working for me, and I'm very frustrated that I can't choose which program works best for me. I lost 60 pounds in 2 years on the old Points program. I've seen a gain since October and cannot make it go away on Points Plus.

Are there ANY plans to give people access to the old program as an option?


"Just keep swimming, just keep swimming..."


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KALOLA11's Photo KALOLA11 SparkPoints: (0)
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3/30/11 8:34 P

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Sorry to repeat a bit, I posted this on the wrong topic. It belongs here:

I'm a bit in limbo here. I really like that we've got a group of like-minded "losers" here, but I'm having trouble getting back to Momentum -- the one that works! You see, I was a major on-line gal. Never really used the books and paper trackers and now that WW has taken away my tool, I'm a little lost. I have my old original little pocket guide, but it's very limited. Thinking of finding a way to figure how many calories my old Momentum Points averaged and just using the Sparks plan.

After all I thought I'd learned, it's rather disappointing to go back to plain old counting calories. But that's the bottom line, isn't it? Burn more calories than you consume?

One good thing: I found a 2009 WW Complete Food Companion (used) on Amazon. Hopefully, that will give me some guidance.



"Just keep swimming, just keep swimming..."


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SWEETROSIE2's Photo SWEETROSIE2 SparkPoints: (12,234)
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3/30/11 8:56 A

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emoticon KALOA it is great to have you here I am sure you will get lots of help on these boards all the best on your weight loss journey.

Rosie Perth Australia (living in Saudi Arabia)


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LEIAFRUMA SparkPoints: (7,203)
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3/30/11 8:21 A

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Hi Kalola,

I could have written your post! I am not giving WW any more $. The people here are great, the groups are supportive, and you get points rather than spending them - or you can spend them on "gifts" for others! I have been here for a week now and I like the Spark log and report much better than the WW online! Once you get used to it, I bet you will too!

emoticon

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3/30/11 8:04 A

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Hi, all.
I just discovered SP yesterday and I'm thrilled to find this team. I was a WW Lifetimer (hit goal in August of 2009) and stayed at goal for 14 months. Just when I had renewed focus to get back to WW, they switched to P+. After two months, I realized it just wasn't working for me.

So, I'll be hear on SP for support, weight and exercise tracking. I'll be using my OLD WW calculator, iFigure and the old Momentum pocket guide. It's going to be tricky, because I was a TOTAL online gal for 2.5 years. But they took it all away! (sniff!)

As much as I LOVED WW and was a big advocate, I feel very betrayed -- like "Big Brother" knows best. Anyway, happy to find this space.

"Just keep swimming, just keep swimming..."


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HUNNNYBEE's Photo HUNNNYBEE Posts: 1,258
3/25/11 6:22 A

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Hi again!
I read through the posts on this board and I am not familiar with the new PP program. It sounds like many are struggling with it. If anyone is interested in the old exchange program from the 1970's, here is a website I came across:

http://www.dwlz.com/WWinfo/old1972ww.htm
l

emoticon

Margaret

People are like stained glass windows: they sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light within.
~Elizabeth Kubler-Ross


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HUNNNYBEE's Photo HUNNNYBEE Posts: 1,258
3/22/11 5:05 P

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Hi!
I've belonged to WW for years. I first went on the program in the 1970's when my mother joined and put our whole family on WW. :) It was the exchange program, based on a diabetic diet. It was very strict, but if you followed the plan properly, you lost weight, it was well balanced, and you wouldn't be hungry.

In 1989, I re-joined, because I wanted to lose the weight I'd gained since having my daughter. This time the program was similar to the old plan...using exchanges...but just like the South Beach Diet, the first few weeks were VERY limited. The idea was to give you a 'jump start' on weight loss. After the first 4 weeks, the program followed the guidelines of the original program.

In 2007, I joined again, along with a friend who wanted to lose weight. We used the Flex Points, although the Core plan was also a choice. This program worked...my friend and I both lost weight, and usually a pound or two every week. The one thing I noticed, as I went from week to week, is that the Flex Points were a bit too lenient for me. I found myself eating things that obviously weren't healthy, but if it was within the points range, I could justify it.

So I've gone back to the 1989 program. It's what works best for me. I no longer go to the WW meetings. I know all 3 WW plans pretty well, and I come to Spark for support. I like the fact that with Spark, I am not limited to meeting times...it's always available, and I'm grateful for that.

I just recently switched back to the 1989 program. I'll let you all know how it goes!

emoticon

Margaret

People are like stained glass windows: they sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light within.
~Elizabeth Kubler-Ross


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MONGO2TEN's Photo MONGO2TEN Posts: 10,883
3/22/11 1:11 P

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I am doing the old plan for at least 1 week. Then I'm going to go along my tracker and figure out how many pp I typically have. I'm not doing it right now because I want to totally focus on the old way. Afterward, I'm going to try doing the pp with the newer total (an average of what I have this week). I know I'm going to count fruits and things like butternut squash.

I've tried to ask on the message boards too. I get a lot of things like, "you're eating too much fruit, not getting enough exercise, not getting in your ghg - something you are doing isn't right." Funny, I maintained on the old plan just fine for nearly 5 years.

~Nancy



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SMILEYTIZZ's Photo SMILEYTIZZ SparkPoints: (5,103)
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3/22/11 12:20 P

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Im doing the old Wendie Plan since I can't afford to do weight watchers online or go to meetings. Ive tried to post and get some answers on the weight watcher site message boards but its too confusing.

Tell Your Loved One's How Much You Love Them Today ,Because Tomorrow May Never Come!!
________________
Starting Weight
3/7/2011 = 233

3/10/2011 = 231 (-2pnds)
3/19/2011 = 229 (-2pnds)
4/9/2011 = 227.8
(-1.2pnds)
4/20/2011 = 226.2
(-1.6pnds)
5/5/2011 =225(-1pnd)
5/26/2011 =224(-1pnd)
6/2/2011 =222.2
(-1.8pnds)
6/25/2011 =220.6 (-1.6pnds)




SmileyTizz


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DAKINIVERONA's Photo DAKINIVERONA SparkPoints: (53)
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3/12/11 6:12 P

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I am using the WW Momentum plan, (switched back from Points Plus when continued to gain after 2 months). I had been on WWMomentum last year and lost 18 pounds (not as much as I like, but being disabled makes it a bit slower). I am using my smart phone application WWDIARY which has a points calculator, barcode scanner, and tracker. It is free and works great for me. I am on a Facebook group as support. Will attend WW meetings until my pass runs out (April 20th). I do not want to track here, or I will get all caught up in the tracking as opposed to having it simply on my phone. I will be on SP for support.

Dakini


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BALTIMOM's Photo BALTIMOM SparkPoints: (14,321)
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3/1/11 8:56 P

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I have been tracking solely here on sparks for about three weeks. It's a bit of work since I find I have to input a lot of nutrition facts for foods that I am not finding in the database. I know that in time they will be there, but it's just so darn easy to only count to 24 vs. 1200-1500. I don't have a smart phone, so it requires computer access, which usually isn't too much of a problem.

I guess I just want to see how it would work.

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3/1/11 8:27 P

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How are you wavering?

Tricia


 current weight: 162.0 
 
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TRICKYLOSER's Photo TRICKYLOSER SparkPoints: (1,483)
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3/1/11 8:26 P

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Sorry, I didn't want to lose it so I hit send. I do MM/Wendy. I had to mix it up to get to goal in Sept. and it worked for me. It has not translated to PP, and I don't think anyone is working it on the WW thread. I still use the ww boards, I believe PP will be great for maintenance.

Anyway, I count the fruits for PP because I am trying to do the math as written. Neither of the plans was supposed to have us working with calories. That being said, you can see my days are all over the boards. I think it is because MM rewarded fiber, (Did you say that) and PP is rewarding fruit.

You should be able to go back and track at least the last week on PP easily. What method would you use for MM? I am writing MM in my 3 month paper tracker, PP on the WW board, and Sp on this board. Man this is a lot of work!!! But it will be worth it when we figure it out!

Tricia


 current weight: 162.0 
 
196.8
184.3
171.8
159.3
146.8
TRICKYLOSER's Photo TRICKYLOSER SparkPoints: (1,483)
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3/1/11 8:15 P

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Baltimom, I think there is a problem with that theory. Feb 24-MM-18 PP-27 SP-1439
25-MM-26 PP-40 SP-1676
26-MM-37 PP-46 SP-2613
27-MO-18 PP-25 Sp-1159
28-MM-18 PP-17 SP-1115
01-MM-18 PP-23 SP-







Tricia


 current weight: 162.0 
 
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184.3
171.8
159.3
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BALTIMOM's Photo BALTIMOM SparkPoints: (14,321)
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3/1/11 7:31 P

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I feel myself wavering... If a PP+ =35 calories, and a MMP=50, then I can have 24 points a day. I think I am going to try it next week and see how it goes. I will count fruit, 3 points for bananas even. I can still use the 49 weeklies, since that compares to the 35 weeklies we got on Momentum.

I have all this new material that I was crazy enough to buy. But if the math works, then I should lose. Right?

 current weight: 119.0 
 
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TRICKYLOSER's Photo TRICKYLOSER SparkPoints: (1,483)
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3/1/11 10:06 A

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I am triple tracking, MO,PP, and SP. I am finding it all very interesting, and spoke to my daughter last night and she has the MO paperwork and is sending it this weekend. I have seen the scale go down, I am a daily weigher and am still going to meetings for the accountability.
Tricia A

Tricia


 current weight: 162.0 
 
196.8
184.3
171.8
159.3
146.8
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