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4FITNESSNOW's Photo 4FITNESSNOW SparkPoints: (376)
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9/23/12 5:20 P

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This is the group I need. I go to WW and am down around 50 pounds. At my half way point I was searching for some motivation after a binge and found Spark. Still want to go to WW, but I must be honest and say that I go back to really old basic plan. 2 dairy. 3 fruit, 2 bread. 3 oz proiten lunch and 6 oz dinner. It is interested starting putting my calories and watching the nutrition information. Oh the tsp fats is in there also. Ride my bike to work a couple miles and just joined the gym. It works for me as long as I remember my sugar addiction gets me in trouble.. I keep searching for motivation to contuine this journey. Focus is on getting fit not skinny because that has never worked for me.

keep going


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DICKENSDUDLEY Posts: 24
8/10/12 11:13 A

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Hi. WOW! I am so glad and relieved to see that my journey with WW was not the only one who suffered problems. I became a member back in 2008, Flex plan, and lost 38 pounds in the first 6 months. I was tickled to death! After that, things slowed down, dripped slowly, and then quit. I plateaued literally for 9 months. I would go up and down tenths of pounds, but the whole number never changed. Talk about depressing and frustrated. I reached a point where I got sick of going to meetings seeing everyone else get awards and sometimes I was the only one out of the entire group not getting a thing. That's a little hard to swallow after 9 months, paying your monthly dues, and not losing a thing! Sparks has given me some much needed motivation and spirit back. I know a lot of folks who like WW because of simple they have made it to track with points. I think though they forget, purposely, that they are still in fact counting calories and restricting calories. At least with Sparks I can see on a chart the break down of everything, including sodium, which has become a biggy for me in the past couple of years. I missed making LT status with WW by 11 pounds. I did eventually stop going and paying. I tried online for a while with Points Plus, but lost nothing. I have returned to Sparks and am seeing improvement on the scale already!!

THORNITA SparkPoints: (1,803)
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3/30/12 5:12 P

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I started propoints in january and I'm only losing 1/4 pound a week if i'm lucky, I feel as a fruit lover I was eaten too much fruit as it was free. I logged my food on here too find out I was eaten at maintenance level. I was very successful on the old system so have decided to go back to that hopefully will see some results.

FILFLA SparkPoints: (1,124)
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2/27/12 12:14 P

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Linbein, try this Iphone app - Nutrition - it has the WW old points system - i love it!!!!

LINBEIN Posts: 1
9/27/11 1:22 P

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Wow!
I am amazed that this many people are experiencing the same thing with this new P+ plan. I did WW back in 2005-06. I lost 45 lbs in 9 months. I always considered myself more of a "slow loser". But I never had a problem seeing my steady "decline" on the weight charts. I miss the Flex plan!!! Granted, 20 pts a day (which is where I was by the end) was not a lot, but you know, I never felt deprived.
I re-joined WW in January of this year. I have only lost 15 lbs. By this point in my weight loss last time arund, I was at goal! I still have 25 lbs to lose this time around. The weight is just NOT coming off. I have basically not lost anything since the beginning of May. I started double tracking by entering in my food here last week. I have gained 2 weeks in a row. I am curious to see just how many calories I am consuming by following this P+ plan. I did go a little above my spark calorie range 2 days last week, but according to my WW tracker, I was still good. But I gained a pound? Something is definitely not right here.
My Mom joined WW online a few months ago, and she has only lost like 2 lbs, and she has about 70 lbs to lose.
WW had really better wake up and see that this is just not a successful, good results plan they have going on right now.
I really want to go back to my old Flex points, but I really like being able to use the WW mobile app on my phone, and it only uses the new P+. I need to dig out my old WW info, and see if I can correlate it to fit into my spark plan here.

PARRGIRL's Photo PARRGIRL SparkPoints: (1,722)
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8/12/11 11:23 A

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I am SO glad to have found this site and the board! Amen sisters in this weight loss battle (not a journey, but a BATTLE). Like everyone else here, WW has been my dear friend in the past. I've also made what I hope to be lifetime friends in my meetings. However, since WW began tweaking their plan in 2002 - 2 weeks after I made lifetime mind you, I've struggled. It took me almost 5 years to gain back the 20 lbs that I lost in 2002 PLUS 10 of their friends. In 2002, using the Winning Points plan, I lost 17 lbs in 18 weeks. Since the roll out of PP+ I've only lost 2.8 lbs! What's wrong with this picture!!

I started tracking my food on SP on Wednesday during a protest and boycott of my usual Wednesday WW meeting. I also dug out old WW material (being a pack rat does have advantages) and did a few Internet searches and found the Wendie Plan that helps shake up the points so "keep your body guessing". Well, on the PP+ plan, I now get 29 daily points PLUS 49 weekly points PLUS any AP that I earn. The meeting leader encourages everyone to eat all of your points. When everything "costs" more points on PP+ you go along with the program because on the surface, it makes sense...until you don't lose any weight. Well, on my old plan, I now get 22-29 points a day - no extra weekly plus I can add AP as I earn them if I choose, PLUS the "cost" of things are lower (gotta love a 2 point glass of wine over a 4 point one!).

I just love the SP report feedback feature! After tracking on SP for the last two days, I've discovered that while my calorie intake is on track, my fat, protein and fiber numbers were low. Who new that I wasn't getting enough fat? Switched a couple of things after the first day - 2% Starbucks cappuccino instead of FF - 2% plain greek yorgurt instead of FF. I'm now more satisfied with my food choices. I'm double tracking to make sure that I'm still in line with the old WW plan - might go back to triple track after a week just to compare. Might or might not return to the meetings - only time will tell.

~Pam in California~

Out of the Mouths of Babes ~ words to remember and thoughts to work on:

"My stomach's not hungry, my mouth's hungry." ~ Zach, age 4

"Whenever we pass by here, my eyes make my tummy hungry." ~ Family Circus cartoon outside ice cream shop


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EMERALDGECKO SparkPoints: (0)
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8/11/11 3:03 P

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I have been reading this thread and have to say this has been my experience as well. I have been on PP for 6 weeks and initially lost about 3.5 lbs the first week and have been losing and gaining half a pound back and forth ever since. It has been incredibly frustrating as I have tried every variation of the PP system to help spur weight loss as well as exercise. I can see from nutrition tracking here how unbalanced my eating was even following the good health guidelines.
I am now tracking here and in less than the first week have lost .2 lb - not much but at least forward movement again and eating in a very balanced way. I have to appreciate the visual information I gain here by knowing exactly how much of everything I am eating and how it fits within the optimum composition my body needs not only for weight loss but general repair. I find it very motivating and nothing is better than results however small!

CREAMPUFF68 Posts: 26
7/25/11 3:23 P

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Sounds just like me, I started WW with a weight of 194.6 and went down to 130 - now at 148.1 as of Saturday but it was a little over 153..I'm so ready to drop e-tools especially since it really doesn't do me any good as I converted back to Momentum.

PASTORBETH's Photo PASTORBETH SparkPoints: (9,619)
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7/23/11 9:37 A

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Irisblues7~

My experience has been very similar to yours. I lost 50 pounds in a year (from Feb 2010-March 2011) using the Momentum system. But since then (and switching to Points Plus) I have played at losing and gaining the same 5 pounds. I tried everything. And even though I still have 50-60 pounds to lose I only have 29 PP per day.

I began tracking my calories and found out that eating 29 points I was only consuming 1100 calories which by most nutritionists is NOT enough for a healthy body. And for me to hit the number of calories that are healthy for my current weight with the goal of losing weight, I have to eat 35-39 PP per day. Doing this leaves little (or no) weekly points for the ever-popular WW "rewards" or treats!

I really think the major flaw in PP is the removal of calories from the point calculator.



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LOVEPETO Posts: 9
7/11/11 8:37 A

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Points Plus has to be one of the worst ideas WW has ever devised. All I lost was 4 weeks and 2 days .... I've gone back to good ol' points.

CLEWING's Photo CLEWING SparkPoints: (957)
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7/9/11 11:04 P

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I have been doing Spark for almost two weeks now while also doing my WW Points +. What I have discovered is that while eating withing my calories, carbs, fat and protein (and I'm also tracking fiber as I have diverticulosis and need to eat high fiber), my points are all over the place. I get 37 points, and some days at 1700 calories (about mid range of my calories) I'll only be at 27 or so points, which means if I was to get all my points in, I'd be upwards of 2100 calories or more. Other days at 1700 calories, I'd be at 47 points, one day at 54. So my intake is up and down. Plus, tracking points gives me no indication if I'm getting enough protein, too many carbs, etc. It's been 12 days now on Spark and I have hit inside my goals every single day.

Tomorrow I hope to start exercising. The first week I was on no exercise due to a back injury, but I've been given the OK now to get back to exercising. Then last Saturday I got extremely sick with a BAD sinus infection. Feeling back to normal today, but now playing catch up with housework, errands, etc.

I plan to cancel my WW membership tomorrow. I have paid my online dues every month since Point + started, without losing anything, and maybe being off point three times in those eight months. On Momentum I had lost over 70 pounds in 16 months.

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IRISBLUES7 SparkPoints: (811)
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7/9/11 5:30 P

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I must be some sort of anomaly.
I have been at WW since January 2009, so I was there for the launch of P+. I had lost 76 pounds when the program started then came to a dead stop. The first two weeks I gained and after that I would loose one week and gain the next. It took me seven months to loose 5 pounds.
That all sounds VERY similar to the stories that people have already been telling, but for me, it gets a bit weird. I have known for some time that P+ has been encouraging me to eat differently than I used to, but I also SUSPECTED off and on that P+ has not been giving me ENOUGH calories.
After months of not loosing, there were occasional weeks where I simply didn't see the point of WW. I would briefly neglect to track and eat any damn thing I wanted, as much as I wanted, and it was often unhealthy. I would only do this for a few days during the week, but the amount of calories consumed should have been enough to derail my weight loss for the week.
More often than not however, these were the weeks that I actually LOST weight. At the time I assumed that this was just a fluke, or a carry-over from something I did RIGHT two weeks prior. The weightloss (and my bad behavior) would motivate me to try even harder and stay on plan the following week... when I would typically loose absolutley nothing, or gain the weight right back.

The first two days I started tracking at SP, I actually had to consume between 31 and 34 points just to get above 1200 calories (and yes, I made sure that the points were accurate). The next two days I started trying to change the TYPE of foods I chose. I began selecting things that had a larger calorie load per point, and I could reach my calorie target by eating only 28 and 29 points.
This week I apparently ate more calories than I had been before... and I lost 2.8 pounds.
I will only know if this is just the start of another yo-yo session by next week, but when I have gone down (and then back up again) in the past, it wasn't usually by this much.

Edited by: IRISBLUES7 at: 7/9/2011 (17:32)
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CLEWING's Photo CLEWING SparkPoints: (957)
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6/30/11 9:47 P

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Boy, everyone is saying the same thing I feel. I was SHOCKED today when I compared calories on here and PP. After lunch and an afternoon snack I was at 1005 calories (I get about 1600 minimum on here), but had only used 18 PP (I get 37). That means by the time I eat all my points, I'd could be up over 2000 calories! WW is going to lose a lot of members if they don't wake up.

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CDGOLDILOCKS's Photo CDGOLDILOCKS Posts: 230
6/29/11 11:40 P

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I did well on PP the first week. I didn't like how I was feeling though, so one day I logged my food on the SP tracker, adding in my 29 points worth of food. I realized I had eaten 1130 calories. I asked someone at work who was a LTM, and she said to start using weekly points. I did....and gained 3 pounds that week. I work out a LOT. I measure all my food. I have a bodybugg that tells me what I burn. Sorry, but it HAS to be the PP that has me not losing. The last time I used WW after my oldest was born, I lost weight without such a struggle. The past week I tracked calories on SP and find I am doing much better.

I think I will be using the calculator that was posted for momentum. I like counting points and USED to like WW, but the PP plan in my opinion makes this whole process unnecessarily complicated. I don't know when to "eat to my satisfaction" when it comes to fruit. I am fat because I don't know when to quit. THAT is why I need rules, portions. I was probably eating 600 calories a day in fruits and veggies. I take bulk to a whole new level.

I DO like tracking my food on SP because it is so easy, and I can track fiber, carbs,etc. Also, if I am struggling, another Sparker can see my food log and offer suggestions.

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READERSB's Photo READERSB SparkPoints: (15,397)
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5/23/11 9:57 A

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I stayed on Momentum when PP was introduced, modifying the online tracker using all the tricks that people use (entering dummy points to bring the 29 down to the MM number and using quick add and the recipe builder). Then I started double-tracking, and eventually triple-tracking on Sparkpeople, PP and MM. As everyone knows, that showed that the 29 PP points were too many for me, but at least I avoided the weight gain others experienced because I was already tracking calories here.

In the end, like Kathie, I ended up just tracking calories here. Once your favorites and food groupings are loaded, it's quite easy--not quite as easy as the WW tracker, which was really great--but certainly very doable.

I've had a lot of success tracking calories, and the information that SP gives has greatly improved my understanding of healthy eating.

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KATHIE_B's Photo KATHIE_B SparkPoints: (31,120)
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5/17/11 4:12 P

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I've been a LTM for 20 years. I've gone through a lot of WW plans and all of them worked. I have my slip-ups and went over goal a few times but it was because of my actions, not the WW plan. Not so with PP (aka pounds plus). I started following Momentum again but decided to try tracking calories (and nutritional components) on Spark.

Actually I thought it would be a difficult transition but it wasn't. I am already making healthy choices (most of the time). After 20 years I know what's good for me. It was easy to add the foods I normally eat to "My Favorites" and to type in the nutritional info provided in most of the recipes. And when I am winging a new dish I just keep track of the ingredients and type them in--Spark does the rest. So it became easier.

The number of calories Spark recommended matches the number that would have corresponded to Momentum if you convert old points to calories. And its working for me. If I am out and about I can update my tracker with my iPad. No little paper tracker to lose. And no paying WW to track on their system. I still weight free once a month & always will for personal accountability.

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MOMTO3CUTEBOYS's Photo MOMTO3CUTEBOYS Posts: 603
5/13/11 8:54 P

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I went back to momentum too. I was told by someone that I was eating enough calories with pp to gain five pounds a week. No wonder I have been having such a hard time with pp, happy I changed back. I have also been told by a friend that lives in a different state that her leader admitted that she went back on momentum too because she was gainin on pp and putting her leader postion in jeapordy......to me that really says something!

The three very best things I've ever done in my life are Ty William, Bryce Julius, and Preston Scott.

R: Refuse to Quit
O: Overcome Obstacles
A: Account for my Actions
R: Reach all my Goals

The question should be, is it worth trying to do, not can it be done. - Allard Lowenstein

Nothing is IMPOSSIBLE, the word itself says "I'M POSSIBLE"!!! ~Audrey Hepburn

The toughest lift of all, is YOUR ass off the couch.


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MONGO2TEN's Photo MONGO2TEN Posts: 10,883
5/5/11 5:35 A

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I agree, just do the old plan or tweak the new one. If you are like me and need the accountability, continue the meetings and weigh in. I find the topics are still helpful for me and just ignore the PP part of the discussion.

~Nancy



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LEIAFRUMA SparkPoints: (7,203)
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5/4/11 6:20 A

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Working the Spark program like momentum has made it easier to stick with my goals. I try to stay at the low end of my range - but if I am hungry I can eat to the top of my range or if I have an event coming up, I bank those daily calories and use like the weeklies on WW. It is the same thing - just without using points.

Personally, I am dissatisfied with the way Corporate WW is treating people and I have decided that I would better spend my money on organic food or something fun like camping gear, than on monthly meetings or web subscriptions. I blew quite a bit of moolah on PP. Thank goodness the cookbooks also list nutrition info and not just points. I really like the feedback I get here on Spark - I can get a quick visual display of stats and progress with a click of the mouse. Nice.

That said, if Momentum worked for you and you still have your materials, why not use Momentum? If you don't have your old slide or calculator you can use one online like at www.onemorepound.com or can make your own using excel.

Edited by: LEIAFRUMA at: 5/4/2011 (06:23)
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KJF1104 SparkPoints: (377)
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5/3/11 10:41 P

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It makes me so sad that PP is not working for me. I love WW and the last 2 plans helped me lose over 60 pounds! I have 25 more to go and I just feel lost now without WW. I like Leia's plan too. My question is how are you guys doing momentum or flex? Are you just using old books and calculators?

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JENNIEBEAN's Photo JENNIEBEAN Posts: 1,516
4/25/11 9:51 A

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LEIAFRUMA, I like your plan a lot! I have been doing roughly the same thing... I discovered that on Momentum, I was at around 1200 cals/day, if I stuck only to my 18pts. With activity and weeklies, I knew I could eat more than that, so I would allow myself maybe an extra 100 a day, and one splurge meal a week. When I can hold myself to that, it seems to work well. I do about 1350 calories a day, give or take 50-100, and then let myself eat whatever I feel like eating, to satisfaction (and even to FULL, though I am working on that. Stopping when satisified is tough for me w/ things like pizza or any other eat-out/take-out meal) once a week. I think it works out to the same general thing as your plan.

I, too, have been overeating lately and am psyched to be back OP today. Have fun on that hiking trip! DBF and I have our yearly one planned for our 4th anniversary. That will be the week following Memorial Day. Can't wait! Up in NH, the hiking is so great. Good luck getting back on track. I am sure you can do it! Sometimes we all just need to hit the reset button. :)

"Sweat cleanses from within. It comes from places a shower will never reach."
-Dr. George Sheehan

"Do, or do not. There is no 'try'."
-Yoda


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LEIAFRUMA SparkPoints: (7,203)
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4/24/11 9:54 A

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Points Plus did not work for me. I was successful on the other versions of the points plans, including momentum. I really like the 35 bonus points a week and so I have decided to tweak the way I use Spark to mimic the aspects of WW that worked for me.

My calorie range on Spark is 1200-1450 so my base per day is 1200 with 250 per day or 1750 bonus calories per week. (this is roughly equivalent to 35 bonus points @ 50 cal per point.)

I have been overeating lately and need to get back on track. I have a 3 day hiking trip coming up and won't be able to track in the woods, but plan on tracking between now and Wednesday when we leave and then again on Saturday when I return.

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SHARILEE_OHIO's Photo SHARILEE_OHIO SparkPoints: (32,442)
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4/23/11 6:35 P

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I switched back to Momentum almost two weeks ago and I have been triple tracking (calories at Sparks, PP and Momentum). I will probably stop tracking PP after my next WI and stick with just tracking Momentum and calories.

Pounds lost since July 2010: 48

Pounds to reach goal: 14.0

"Bad habits are like a comfortable bed, easy to get into, but hard to get out of" (unknown)

"Energy and persistence conquer all things" (Benjamin Franklin)




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SUNNYBLUESKIES1 Posts: 64
4/23/11 6:29 A

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I also have been triple tracking for the past few days. The first day I was at 24 p on each Plan, Flex and Points Plus. The next day I was 22 for Flex Points and 22 for Points Plus so technically I could eat an additional 7 points on Points Plus. Yesterday I ate a bit more and was at 30 FP and 29 Points Plus.

Perhaps if we were allotted the 29 points but needed to count fruits the way we used to, it would work for those of us that have been having a struggle with 'trying to lose weight'! When I am not using up 3 or 4 PP for fruit, then I've got those available for other foods and then I am getting in extra calories. It took quite a while before my leader said, "you don't have to eat all your points if you have gotten all your GHG's and are satisfied". Initially I heard, "you can eat them all and those extra 49 too".

I think psychologically I like working with the smaller #s on the Flex Plan/Momentum, rather than 29 and 49 on Points Plus. And this has been alot of work to figure this stuff out. I have spent alot of time searching the WW board for information from people like us that are struggling. There is a lady named Mirabilis that took a poll, around 4/6 (she took several actually), for people to say how many points they got, and how many they have been able to eat and lose weight. If you do a search on WW.com under her name you will find it. And for those in the less to lose category or petite and who weighed less than l30 could not eat all their points without gaining.

Won't it be interesting to see what changes come in the future vindicating those who said they were doing the plan as written and were gaining on Points Plus. My hat is off to all of us who have stuck with it and have pursued what will work for them. This is the third program I have seen, 4th if you want to call the changes to the Core Plan in 2006 where you could only eat a small group of Core foods for your snack (they got rid of that the next year) and except for the bruhaha over that on the Core board, I have never seen such a problem with any plan. It's just unbelievable really. A plan that caused a certain amount of people to gain weight. Obviously many people are having success with it, so for many people it is great, but I wonder how well it was tested on older, or petite, or close to goal, smaller women.

Edited by: SUNNYBLUESKIES1 at: 4/23/2011 (06:40)
FIT4SURE's Photo FIT4SURE SparkPoints: (13,895)
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4/22/11 11:50 A

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I've "triple-tracked"...PP, Momentum and calories. I have to do 18-19 Momentum to lose and then maintain at 130-ish pounds. 29 PP caused me to gain 8 lbs. I went back to Momentum and (keeping up with the calories at the same time here on sparkpeople) found that my old 18-19 is about 25. I either have to count fruit or just go back to Momentum. So...I went back to Momentum and am keeping calories some days as well (to keep my eye on the nutritional aspect) and when I get back to my happy weight...then I'll be keeping calories for maintenance here on Sparkpeople (which is AWESOME!) It looks like by my scale that it's working...

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RUN4FUN04's Photo RUN4FUN04 SparkPoints: (2,615)
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4/22/11 10:11 A

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I haven't done very well tracking calories here, but for the last week I decided to track both P+ and Momentum (which I'm using again.) It was similar to your experience -- even on the days I went into my weekly points (Momentum) big time, I never reached 29 P+. I ranged from 20 to 28, with the average being 23 -- no weekly points and no activity points.

I think it's clear that Points + needs some adjustments for some of the members. I hope WW gets the message.

Gail


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MONGO2TEN's Photo MONGO2TEN Posts: 10,883
4/22/11 6:35 A

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I've never compared. I don't measure my veggies, so that's always kept me from tracking on spark. I need to do it and give it a try.

~Nancy



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LYNLORD SparkPoints: (0)
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4/22/11 6:28 A

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Hi everyone
After finding out about sparkpeople and following that yesterday but still tracking on my WW tracker I found that at the end of the day, after eating enough calories for healthy nutrition and weight loss, fats, proteins, water and oils- instead of 29 points I was at 21 points in the WW tracker. I do understand now why I've been gaining weight on the PP system. 29 is far too much for me and I think there are many who are struggling with this. I've been on WW for 8 years and have been maintaining for the last 3- and since they've changed the system I've had problems. I'm sticking with counting calories for now!

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