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9/7/12 3:57 P

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helpful

ARTEMISTHEGREEK's Photo ARTEMISTHEGREEK Posts: 273
9/5/12 11:25 P

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Great discussion, and I do agree that freezing foods in most cases better preserves nutrients than canning, but canning your own and knowing exactly what's in there is better than picking most of these items off the grocery shelves. It's also better than punting as I had to do in 2011 when I was subjected to three extended power outages.

Yes, most tomatoes today are bred to be less acidic, and thus the general need to add some source of acid for canning. Some recipes will permit lemon juice. They always specify bottled, not from the lemon itself (I don't know the rationale on that, actually.)



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9/2/12 6:59 P

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interesting

LITTLEWIND53's Photo LITTLEWIND53 Posts: 14,217
9/2/12 1:00 A

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Margie, thanks for adding so much information.

I was shown once (several years ago now) a chart that said how much of nutrition is lost by the processing of foods, frozen, and canned and even just normal deteriation of daily sitting after picked. Many foods are picked while not yet ripe so the food is not over ripe by the time it gets to the store shelves. This too affects the quality....

Apparently almost 20 percent nutrient is lost in the canning process while only about 5 percent is lost in freezing assuming the items are frozen fresh from the garden. This was based on large manufacturing facilities located next to growing fields and foods processed within hours of being picked, there being no transport time involved.

Of course in todays world, it can take days, even weeks, between the foods being picked and set out on the store shelves depending on the distance needed to travel. Then many people take it home and store in fridge, maybe another week or so before all used up. So if one has the resources to grow thier own gardens, it is obviously going to deliver a better product, whether eaten fresh or canned, or frozen.

But as you said, all this is nothing next to the love and care one puts into thier own canning. However, the general carbohydrates (and fats, sugars and protien if applicable) would remain much the same for general tracking processes.



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MARGIE100%PURE's Photo MARGIE100%PURE Posts: 1,513
9/1/12 5:46 P

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I, too, see a lot of value in following this thread. I am intolerant of vinegar (sulfur), citric acid (yeast processed- and my own liver conflict to natural vitamin C food sources like fresh lemon juice). Even cane sugar that also has sulfur I must avoid. Canning for myself will allow me greater variety of more than a few days but possibly months more.

My desire to get these following comments is piqued. Is the nutrition listed on the commercial labels after cooking and canning? Or are they claiming the fresh value of a food before processing is still in their highly steamed highly process food? Would an extension service or the FDA have the answer or platitudes to appease?

Because every time heat calories or lengths of time touch the food volatile fragile nutrients are lost. This is part of why we are not getting enough omega-3s with the vitamin E carriers and other fatty acids, the processing is aggressive. The soil is poor or the warehouse held a grain in a silo through too many months.
Here is an example of why homemade farm raised/grazed is better: Fresh pasture grazed beef contains 5000 times more omegas and a higher ratio of the 3s over the 6s. (because too many 6s can block the quality 3s from going into the body cells, heart trouble); than that CAFO Concentrated Animal Feeding Operation cattle ranch raised with lesser amounts of 3s and high 6s than wanted yet both are Omega fatty acids by name; hence the big need for graze fed proteins. Three carbon atoms in each molecule of fatty acid. The body cannot make any omega 3s. They are essential and many synthesizing steps a needed to get it out of food.

My guess is to compare a book average nutritional value with the label of a similar commercial product to your own home goods to compare and contrast the processing losses and changes. The difference may be averaged and assumed to match gram for gram ounce per ounce of the book listings, if the batch went well maybe better! A difference is in the love you put in it. My family can taste the difference.

Maybe there is a complicated mathematical formula that uses a division of time over temperatures of spent heat calories; calculated with consideration of density of the cellulose fibers (pressure necessary to break the cellulose walls of plant fibers in cooking so the good stuff is reachable by the human gut. For some foods cooking releases special nutrients that raw would bypass the gut without releasing like lycopene of tomatoes); then subtracted from your resource books listed value of original fresh raw food averages. It seems like a lot of work for just calorie counting values. Great question, though! I do not know.
20 minutes/at medium heat around sterile jar of sun ripened farm fresh tomatoes= good stuff

We all know that when it is good it is consumed almost instantaneously after hours of loving preparations.

I gave our veterinarian a jar of local native Mayhaw berry jelly and my dentist some cumquat marmalade. These simple unexpected gifts spoke volumes when a balloon or a thank you card would have bombed at my intended message of bigger than normal thanks.

Maybe the professionals at University of California at Davis where tons of foods are being researched every day would answer? Research in Food Science & Technology UC Davis Food Science ...
.www-foodsci.ucdavis.edu/rese
arch
- 18k - similar pages-Research in Food Science & Technology. Research in the Food Science and Technology department is clustered into several main excellence areas. We have ...

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9/1/12 4:32 P

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all the best

SHONADOG's Photo SHONADOG Posts: 1,864
9/1/12 9:55 A

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One year we forgot to add the lemon juice to a batch of tomato sauce and they went bad.

Mary

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LITTLEWIND53's Photo LITTLEWIND53 Posts: 14,217
8/31/12 11:14 P

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I asked my sister this question and she said because most modern tomatoes have been genetically modified to produce a lower-acid tomato now-a-days, so the lemon is to up the acid content. As for the sugar, that is just a matter of taste (some people like them a bit sweeter)

I never used a pressure canner, just water bath, and they always turned out fine, but that was many years ago. My MIL taught me and I just did was she said.... I don't do any canning anymore as I cannot stand long enough at one time to get the job done. I either dehydrate or freeze everything now. Heaven help me if my freezer ever quits or we have a major power outage (knock on wood)

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MISWULF's Photo MISWULF SparkPoints: (677)
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8/31/12 10:50 P

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or ball blue book. whichever you decide it to be.

have no idea where the blue balls came in.

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8/31/12 10:48 P

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i suppose it depends on if you follow the directions in the blue ball book. there they state 2T. lemon juice per quart at 10 pounds pressure for 20 minutes. honestly i dont' notice a different taste other than tomato sauce. honestly i always wondered why you would want to add more acid *lemon juice* to your base acid *tomato sauce*. and what is the purpose of adding a little sugar to cut the acid anyway? doesn't that defeat the purpose of adding lemon juice anyway? maybe the canning goddesses can answer that one.

i prefer also to just make a basic tomato sauce since i never know what i want to make, or what my husbands stomach is going to be like (3 hiatal hernia surgeries in 3 years). also not sure exactly how to add the seasonings and have it come out the same every time. am sure all i would have to do is measure everything evenly but then i am the type that adds spices by a "yeah that looks good" measurement.

anyway, back to the original question, lol, it's not about taste. it's about following the bbb guidelines.

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LITTLEWIND53's Photo LITTLEWIND53 Posts: 14,217
8/31/12 10:24 P

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Yup, Much better than commercial, however we do it and whatever our recipes....

But why do you say ".... and of course lemon juice." When I made and canned my own tomato sauce I just put herbs (basil, maybe some celery seed, etc) but never any lemon juice which would chane the taste of the finished product...... Do you like the taste the lemon juice ads? Just asking.....

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MISWULF's Photo MISWULF SparkPoints: (677)
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8/31/12 8:35 P

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i am quite interested in responses as well. so far this year all i have put up is green beans, tomato sauce and potatoes. they seem to be the only things growing worth a darn. none of my store has salt in it for personal reasons, so all i have to worry about there is natural sodium. the only things added to my tomato sauce is garlic, onion, green pepper and of course lemon juice.

none of what we put up has all the additives/preservatives that canning companies and food processors use so it is better, right?

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LITTLEWIND53's Photo LITTLEWIND53 Posts: 14,217
8/31/12 7:47 P

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Interesting question and I look forward to the replies.

A lot depends on what food you put up and the method of doing so. I know there are different syrup strength for when canning --- Heavy, medium or light syrup, or do you use any sugar at all??? If dehydrating, how much would the original food have weighed because you sure can't calculate those by volume - or can you????



Linda

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MISWULF's Photo MISWULF SparkPoints: (677)
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8/31/12 5:01 P

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know i am long overdue in saying hi. has been an extremely busy past month or so and am finally taking a little break from it all.

i was wondering how do we calculate nutrition for the foods we put up? i am sure we all put up very different foods with very different ingrediets so was just curious.

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