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ELLEN1159's Photo ELLEN1159 Posts: 317
10/8/13 10:58 A

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Found that group on FB and hit the "join" button, hope it works! I've been slowly cutting down on sugars and grains and next step is working more vegetables into my diet. My doc was pleased with my 35 lb. weight loss at my last checkup one month ago, sugars were down, cholesterol down, BP normal or slightly low (I am still taking a low dose of an antihypertensive drug and a statin drug for the cholesterol). But I've gotten lax since then and the scale hasn't budged.

My goal is to get off both meds. Statin drug might be permanent because high bad cholesterol seems to run in the family (my dad and brother). My brother exercises daily and keeps his weight down but still has to take a cholesterol lowering med. His alcohol consumption is a lot more than mine, don't know what effect alcohol has on cholesterol but it seems to negatively affect all the body systems.

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MOMMYFOSTEJ's Photo MOMMYFOSTEJ Posts: 557
9/26/13 12:16 P

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thanks Noritaarf..... I just went on the facebook to join up with the peri-post menopausal paleo group.... love the paleo groups on facebook!!


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_RAMONA's Photo _RAMONA Posts: 5,471
7/22/13 12:24 P

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You're welcome Ellen!

You're very right to suspect that for you, as a diabetic and insulin resistent, a lot of fruit (carbs) is a problem. I'm not sure what you are taking for medication, but I would think that it would be difficult at this point to gauge what is causing changes in things like blood pressure... though certainly the amount of weight you've lost so quickly would have an impact... but I'm not sure how much this would mend underlying causes.

While the links I've already provided would explain very well how one ends up losing weight eating more fat, here are some links that specifically address that question. It really does require one to question all we've been traditionally taught about fat.

And the question really is: "If fat is the problem, how come eating low-fat has made us sicker and fatter?"

What it comes down to is that your body needs fuel for energy, and to burn fat... you can burn either carbs (sugar), or fat. Burning carbs disrupts fat burning metabolic processes, and if you eat more carbs than you can efficiently burn (and, unless you are a marathon runner, you generally do, as carbs as fuel is inherantly inefficient), your body will store the excess as fat. Fat is more satiating, raises metabolic mechanisms, and cannot be stored. The quality and type of fat you consume is also very important. Some fats (omega 6) are inflammatroy, and inflammation encourages fat storage.

Check these out:

• Why We Get Fat
www.ketogenic-diet-resource.com/why-
we
-get-fat.html

www.youtube.com/watch?v=l59YyXpCT1M

• Diabesity
chriskresser.com/diabesity
(read through the series)

• The Diet-Heart Myth: Cholesterol and Saturated Fat Are Not the Enemy
chriskresser.com/the-diet-heart-myth
-c
holesterol-and-saturated-fat-are-notR>-the-enemy


• The Definitive Guide to Fats
www.marksdailyapple.com/fats/#axzz2Z
n6
atqIm


• What Does It Mean to Be Fat-Adapted?
www.marksdailyapple.com/what-does-it
-m
ean-to-be-fat-adapted/#axzz2Zn7jAMMo


• What Does It Mean to Be Fat-Adapted? – Part 2: Q&A
www.marksdailyapple.com/what-does-it
-m
ean-to-be-fat-adapted-part-2-qa/#axzR>z2Zn7jAMMo


• A Metabolic Paradigm Shift, or Why Fat is the Preferred Fuel for Human Metabolism
www.marksdailyapple.com/a-metabolic-
pa
radigm-shift-fat-carbs-human-body-meR>tabolism/#axzz2Zn9wMfL5




The Physiology of Women’s Weight Loss
• Part I: Estrogen
www.paleoforwomen.com/the-physiology
-o
f-womens-weight-loss-part-i-estrogen/


• Part II: Appetite and Weight Regulation
www.paleoforwomen.com/the-physiology
-o
f-womens-weight-loss-part-ii-appetitR>e-and-weight-regulation/


• Part III: Women, Weight Loss, and Modern America: A World in Need of Revolution
www.paleoforwomen.com/women-weight-l
os
s-and-modern-america-a-world-in-needR>-of-an-evolution-revolution/


• Part IV: The Healthiest, Happiest, Easiest Weight Loss in the World
www.paleoforwomen.com/the-healthiest
-h
appiest-easiest-way-to-lose-weight/


• The Food Addict's Guide to Redemption
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=5381557




Edited by: _RAMONA at: 7/22/2013 (18:13)

'An Apple A Day' keeps the doctor away...
www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-bluep
rint-101/#axzz28X8ooJ1H



NOTE: My weight tracker is NOT a truthful representation of my weight. Instead, I am using it as a tool to help me visualize my goal as though it's already been achieved!

www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
urnal_individual.asp?blog_id=2108522


 current weight: 135.0 
 
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ELLEN1159's Photo ELLEN1159 Posts: 317
7/22/13 9:48 A

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Thanks for the responses. I'm still trying to take everything in. It's hard for me to understand the logic of losing weight by eating more fat. I never understood how people on Atkins didn't drop dead of heart attacks and strokes.

ETL does pull weight off of post-menopausal women who can't exercise, but it permits a good deal of fruit and it seems to me that might be a problem if you are diabetic or in insulin resistant, like me. My blood pressure, which is controlled with medication, was still a little higher than it should be before I started ETL. After the first two weeks and an 11 lb. weight loss, I had my pressure checked at a doctor's appt. and the nurse said it was a little low. However, I have to wait until the end of August to get my blood sugar checked by my regular doctor, so I don't know how a low fat vegan plan would affect that. I should say, my attempts to stick to ETL, I never followed it to the letter for more than a day because it's so restrictive.

When I read your history of paleo/primal/ancestral, I had to laugh when you described the really hard-core paleo adherents as being rigid and uncompassionate....that's exactly how I've heard some former vegans talk about their old philosophy. I guess Voltaire was right, "Doubt is an unpleasant condition, but certainty is an absurd one."


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MAUITN's Photo MAUITN Posts: 12,880
7/21/13 4:11 P

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I tried the ETL diet and easily lost 20+ pounds, but my cholesterol jumped way up and my doctor was not happy. I have recently joined and am experimenting with Paleo/Primal (more Primal). I haven't lost any weight yet, but will keep working on it. That Facebook group sounds interesting.

ps: I'm 67 years old, need and to lose 10 pounds

Earnie - Monteagle, TN
“I would love to live like a river flows, carried by the surprise of its own unfolding.” -John O'Donohue

www.flickr.com/photos/8894287@N06/

If something is holding us back, today is the day to begin to push back. Today is always the best day to end the fears and begin being the best you.

At the end of every road there is something worth seeing.


 current weight: 137.8 
 
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MISSJCISRUNNING's Photo MISSJCISRUNNING Posts: 13,631
7/21/13 2:41 P

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Norita, it's Jackie!

Please join the 40+ women's group on Facebook! https://www.facebook.com/groups/1697
32
309823434/


Jackie Chatman, MA, NC
Eating for Wellness Nutrition and Fitnness
Certified Holistic Nutritionist
Www.eatingforwellness.net
www.facebook.com/pages/Eating-for-We
llness/103022173087868


ELLIE381's Photo ELLIE381 SparkPoints: (102,943)
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Posts: 14,145
7/21/13 2:09 P

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I am a 56 yr old female and am now enjoying the Paleo eating plan. I did try it over a year ago and found it difficult but this time around it just seems to have clicked. I am the only one in our house that eats this way so at times the smell of things bother me or should I say make me want them but once I think about it I really don't even want it.

I agree I am finally getting rid of the belly fat that has never gone before. It has been about 6 months now and I cannot see changing anything.

emoticon

Ontario, Canada


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_RAMONA's Photo _RAMONA Posts: 5,471
7/21/13 1:45 P

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Hi, Ellen! Coincidentally, I'm 53 years old, and I've been following an 'Ancestral' nutrition plan for 23 months. I've lost 60 pounds (pretty much all of it off my belly... I started at 250), and I've gone from literally planning my funeral, to living life to the FULL and medication free (I even just bought a bathing suit last week... first one in 6 years... in a size 12... down from a size 20!). My whole family eats this way (husband and 9-year-old), we love it and don't have any problem sticking to it, and everyone has experienced health benefits.

If simple weight loss is your goal and primary measurement of success, you might find this discouraging because obviously my elimination of fat has been SLOW, and continues to be, but my health continues to improve daily, and while I've eliminated fat (not lean tissue) I've continued to gain strength. Because the inclination to accumulate fat is hormone driven, women 'of a certain age' don't usually get the dramatic results some do, especially when there are exacerbating health issues.

Addtionally, I would personally say that strict 'Paleo' will make things worse for you (much the same way as did 'Eat to Live')... too little fat. Here's an explanation, and the links to some blog posts releveant to your query:



Oversimplified, and solely as a 'diet':

'Paleo' is rigid in attitude and would be considered low-fat, ultra low-carb (less than 50 grams/day), LEAN protein, no processed food - the majority of your daily calories would come from protein.

'Primal' is individualized and would be considered high-fat, moderate carb (50-150 grams/day), moderate RICH protein, and allows for processed food if it only includes health supporting ingredients - the majority of your daily calories come from fat.

...we chose to begin our journey within a 'Primal' framework because of the above considerations, and because the science supported 'Primal' while raising concerns about 'Paleo'... my approach is and always will be health driven, and science-based.

Regarding the comparison chart (which, I've realized, curiously excludes any mention of legumes - they would come under the same scrutiny as grains) - it does a reasonable job of delineating the common and differentiating characteristics... though the chart is based on the initial books written, is over-simplified, and a tad misleading. It really seems to be all just splitting hairs when you compare Primal/Paleo/Ancestral. If you approach it solely as a 'diet' it comes down to what/who you choose to believe specifically about:
• carbs (Paleo less, Primal more)
• fat (Paleo less, Primal more)
• dairy (Paleo none, Primal as tolerated)
• processed food (Paleo none, Primal as it respects sound nutritional science)
• and preference (Paleo more restrictive/absolute, Primal is individualized as supported by the science and tolerance)

...and how your body responds. If your focus is health related, the distinctions become much more important, and are nuanced, individual and complex.

Comparison Chart: Primal/Paleo/Ancestral, etc.
www.eat-real-food-paleodietitian.com
/s
upport-files/dietcomparisonguide.pdf


If you read everything there is to read on the subject (and I may well have, LOL), it all seems to distil down to this:

'Paleo' was coined by Loren Cordain, who is the mainstream guru of a 40 year old idea - it's been around since the late 60s in a much less defined way - is based on a single focus (genetically we haven't evolved so neither should our food source - never mind that we are meant to evolve), is intellectual in its focus (idea driven), is ultra low-carb (less than 50 grams per day), and believes all nutrition should come from food alone. Paleo is the most restrictive, and doesn't take into account the newest research findings. Hard-core Paleo adherents tend to be elitist/rigid/purists, and a pain in the tookus, because they treat it like a religion... their reasons for eating Paleo come from a place of superiority, and daddy Cordain doesn't play nice with the other kids in the nutritional sandbox. He's also changed a number of his positions as he is increasingly challenged by the rest of the Ancestral community (it's based on incomplete science - eating strict Paleo could, in fact, cause health problems over time... for example Paleo ignores most of the ancestral tribes around the world that consume non-paleo food but are still as healthy as anyone eating 'paleo' (carb levels become the central issue), it's too low on fat, and ignores the obvious benefits of finding a good, clean source of raw dairy and cultured/fermented foods). Cordain is a self-absorbed, sanctimonious, pill. Robb Wolf is a much better advocate for 'Paleo' (plays nice with the other little cavemen), and he and Mark Sisson have more in common than they differ... he also applies the science to 'Paleo' and is evolving as does the science.

'Primal' was coined by Mark Sisson (and I think he may actually own copyright to the term), he's the one who made 'Paleo' attractive and mainstream, it is health driven and science-focussed, and carb load is determined individually according to tolerance within a certain healthy range (50 - 150 grams per day). Primal is the most forgiving and least restrictive "once an individual's unique needs/sensitivities have been allowed for" - which is really 'Ancestral' in the final analysis. The chart is using Mark Sisson's book as it's source, which makes Primal appear as though everyone eats exactly the same way, yet Mark is probably the person who is the most open and supports/acknowledges/allows for a wide range of individuality... as the evidence/science evolves, so does his position... his corporation is usually the front-runner in chasing the science... he is a LIFESTYLE guru (he looks at everything... nutrition, movement, sleep, and supplementation that supports optimal health). His position is that grains/legumes are bad for everyone, but if you don't seem to be experiencing any ill effects from what you're consuming, have at it. Mark is also really sensitive to modern sensibilities... he believes that progress/evolution is GOOD as long as the foundation for change respects sound Ancestral principals, and is supported by the science. This is why 'Mark's Daily Apple' is such a great resource... if it's important to consider, Mark will know about it first, and will tell it to you in a science-based, non-alarmist, easy to understand, balanced way... and not charge you money for it. Mark Sisson is smart, funny and charming... very human and humble.

'Ancestral' is an evolving perspective drawing on the best of Paleo, Primal, and Weston A. Price (which I am carefully exploring... makes sense, Mark acknowledges that there is truth to it applied cautiously, but it is labour intensive to include legumes, dairy and grains under these principles). It emphasizes the health and healing aspects of nutrition. I'm pretty sure that if Mark had thought of it, he'd have coined 'Ancestral' rather than 'Primal', LOL... but then that would have made him the 'Monsanto' of the nutritional world... trying to own and profit from something that belongs to everyone. Unfortunately, Weston A. Price is dead, and can't speak for himself, and his approach is more intuitive and observational... which unfortunately discounts his perspective in the eyes of some. Price was a dentist who became curious about the skeletal/dental malformations that resulted in tribal peoples who adopted European/Western dietary practices, and was the first person to suggest that grains/legumes (and certain dairy) were somehow 'poisonous' to the human body, and then spent a considerable portion of his life figuring out how to make these foods safe to eat based on what he observed in healthy tribal cultures who remained true to their ancestral diets... because there are cultures who do consume grains and legumes to no ill effect. It is his observations, 'experimentation' and methods that sparked the basis for 'Paleo' when it was first applied 40 years ago, and the continued investigational science that has now exploded into a discipline all its own. Weston Price was a humble and curious adventurer, who chased wellness.

So, there you have it... Paleo/Primal/Ancestral in a nutshell, LOL!



PALEO... Do you REALLY know what you're talking about?
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=4964697


LIVIN' Mi Vida Loca! (Snowshoeing!)
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=5258424


True Story
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=5382560


Omentum
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=5392812


Tigers & Strawberries... A New Perspective
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=5367865


'BEFORE' Pictures (May 31, 2009 - September, 2011) & Continuing PROGRESS (February 2012)! Next pictures September, 2013!
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=2108514


Paleo? Why?
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=4970706


Body Fat Set Point: Why It’s So Hard To Lose Weight – And Keep It Off
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=5137543


Is it your fault you are fat?
www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
ur
nal_individual.asp?blog_id=5404834

There are really important links in this one... especially for anyone with your health concerns... Chris Kresser is a really good place to start.

The links go in reverse chronological order (more or less). After reading, if you think this makes sense for you (personally, I don't think anyone can go wrong eating this way), and you have more questions, just holler!

You CAN make this work miracles in your own life!
emoticon



Edited by: _RAMONA at: 7/21/2013 (16:15)

'An Apple A Day' keeps the doctor away...
www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-bluep
rint-101/#axzz28X8ooJ1H



NOTE: My weight tracker is NOT a truthful representation of my weight. Instead, I am using it as a tool to help me visualize my goal as though it's already been achieved!

www.sparkpeople.com/mypage_public_jo
urnal_individual.asp?blog_id=2108522


 current weight: 135.0 
 
250
221.25
192.5
163.75
135
NORITAARF's Photo NORITAARF SparkPoints: (3,173)
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Posts: 13
7/21/13 12:56 P

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You need to come visit and join this facebook group for paleo women over 40 https://www.facebook.com/groups/1697323098
23434/

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DIXIEDOODLEDEAN's Photo DIXIEDOODLEDEAN Posts: 966
7/21/13 12:38 P

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Hi, I'm not strictly paleo. I eat nutritional ketogenic. If you find you can't keep the fat up take a fat bomb or shot. 1 teaspoon TCL (or a healthy coconut oil, olive oil (or hemp) a teaspoon of lemon juice and a small amount of sweet. Take this shot first part of day.

Good luck. I'd have been excited to have that much weight off in 6 weeks.

type with you later. Junebug


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ELLEN1159's Photo ELLEN1159 Posts: 317
7/21/13 12:23 P

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Hi. I've been doing (or trying to do) the Dr. Fuhrman "Eat to Live" plan (low fat vegan). I gave myself six weeks and set a goal of 20 lbs., which seemed reasonable given the success stories I read. My six weeks ends tomorrow and I have taken off 15 lbs. and probably could have lost a lot more. The problem was, after the first two weeks, I found it nearly impossible to stick to, particularly with a teenager in the house that I need to shop and cook for. I ended up eating lean animal protein anyway. I have been able to get rid of refined sugar. Cereals and starches are harder.

I would like to see if I can stick to a paleo plan and I'm wondering how well it might work for a post-menopausal female who takes a statin drug for high cholesterol? The ETL plan did pull a lot of weight off of me fast (6 lbs. first week, 5 lbs. second week), considering my age and the fact that I wasn't even exercising (I have sleep apnea and my energy level isn't great, I'm working on it), but by the third week I just couldn't stay on it any longer. Then again, weight does tend to come off fast in the beginning when you're really overweight, regardless of the eating plan.

Are there any other mature (ahem) gals out there who are having success with a paleo plan? Any posts or blogs you can point me toward?

many thanks!



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