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Paleo anyone?



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RUSSELL_40
Posts: 16,740
5/28/13 5:02 P

Thx Triple, I try..lol

I agree with justeatrealfood. 100 years ago, we didn't eat a bunch of carbohydrates. A meal fit for a king does not have bread, or noodles as a main course. We ate meat, and lard, and yes fruit, and vegetables, but the types of carbohydrates we eat today are not real food, and I do not think we will ever adapt to them. We may adapt to some of the carbs, or even get the ability to eat 10-20% more of them, but the reason we are now dying at a much higher rate from cancer, heart disease, and diabetes is for the very reason that we DID NOT adapt, Jim. If we SLOWLY switched our diets, maybe we could eventually adapt, but switching from a high fat to a low fat diet in a few decades isn't possible.

As I stated, my parents ate eggs, butter, vegetables, fruit, and LOTS of meat. They didn't think eggs were bad food, they knew candy was. The problem with SAD, is that it makes you crave sugars, and starches, and removes the ability to feel full. So while we all know that McDonald's is bad, we can't resist it after eating lasagna for lunch.

I am not saying that following SAD will be harmful directly, I am just saying that SAD is the cause of the overeating. If you eat a high fat/ low carb diet, you will feel full, and won't want to overeat.

SAD is kind of like communism. It sounds pretty good on paper, but in practice, it does not work.

Have we adapted? Yes.Most of us can handle dairy now, so I agree with your idea of adaptation Jim, I just think we pushed too far ahead of our bodies abilities to adapt, and the results are that the body broke down. My great grandmother lived to 98 eating bacon and eggs, and meat/ vegetables for dinner. Is it possible that 3 generations later that my body will adapt to Cheerios/ milk, rice, and noodles? Or even the bread, which is not the same as they ate.They ate healthy, and now we say it is unhealthy, but we are obese with heart disease, and diabetes, hoping cancer isn't next. If this is how evolution works, we will all be dead in 3 more generations.



AMANDANCES
Posts: 1,975
5/28/13 4:51 P

I'm doing some research on Paleo, and it seems as if there are a lot of different versions of it. Some allow dairy and even whole grains, in moderation. The key seems to be eating a lot less processed foods, and limiting starches.

This plan is actually very similar to what my pediatrician has told us to feed our toddler. I guess he's actually eating a Paleo diet without us realizing it!





JIBBIE49
Posts: 55,213
5/28/13 4:02 P

I know that Sparks doesn't approve of anything like the Paleo Diet or Primal, since they promote their cookbook and a high carb diet, but if it works for YOU, then that is what matters.
I've been reading Richard Bernstein MD's "The DIabetes Diet" and it is very low carb (again not something Sparks would approve) but he is a medical doctor who has had Type 1 diabetes since he was 12 and he is a healthy 78 now. So, I find what he writes about in his book "The Diabetes Solution" to be very interesting. I'd suggest reading both of his books and listening to his lectures on YouTube. He sees mostly obese Type 2 patients in his medical practice.



GOPINTOS
SparkPoints: (32,686)
Fitness Minutes: (31,421)
Posts: 6,263
5/28/13 2:29 P

Part of the trouble, when ppl hear the word diet, they think it is something you are on. "Diet" I think in this instance, means foods you eat & consume, not something you are on. These are the foods that make up your diet, like my horse's diet consists mostly of grass in the summer & hay in the winter. He is not on a diet.

I am guessing many to most of the ppl you ask that are following Paleo or Primal or Perfect Health Diet (there's that word again) or any of the other protocols they follow, they do not think they are ON a diet, but rather this IS their diet, the foods that make up their lifestyle.

It was the easiest thing I have ever done, because it was getting back to my roots, the way we were raised. Before fast food, before processed junk, before genetically modified junk - even before the Fat-Free everything phase. Fruits & veggies (Paleo/Primal does not HAVE to be low-carb, but can be. Just depends on your goals) Anyways, fruits, veggies, we raised our own garden, grass-fed meat, or meats hunted or fished, so a good balance of omegas, vitamins, carbs, protein, healthy fats. We were raised with some dairy and soaked beans once in awhile, and even bread back in the day before franken foods took over the majority of the foods in the grocery store.

Paleo/Primal just happens to have a label on it now but it is nothing new.

The occasional birthday party, etc does happen, and that is part of life also.

Little off topic, but now that I make my health a priority, and think about what I eat and my health and longevity, when I hear of someone that dies, especially someone who has lived a nice long life, I always find myself wondering what they ate. And on a couple of occasions, I have even asked. When they start rattling off the list of things, it could be classified and labeled as Paleo/Primal. They just thought they were eating good for you foods :)

I also wonder about those that die too young, with health issues, and I also wonder what they ate and how they might have been able to reverse things with better choices. I know that I was on the verge of many bad things before I finally woke up.

Anyways, I find that many times, I choose different words over the word "diet" because some ppl think it is something you are on, when really I mean these are the foods that I eat, my lifestyle.



JUSTEATREALFOOD
Posts: 993
5/28/13 10:11 A

But people haven't been eating such a high level of carbohydrates for 10,000 years!

Disclaimer! I am using these links just for the graphs.

Scroll down to the sugar graph. Only around 1850 did sugar consumption really rise dramatically.
.
www.proteinpower.com/drmike/saturated-fat/
changing-dietary-trends-and-the-obesit
y-epidemic/


Total carbohydrate intake increased dramatically over the last 50 years as well.

Scroll to Chart 1: Carbohydrates consumed per day per person as measured in grams, and obesity rates.

www.garmaonhealth.com/diet/carbs-sugar-mak
es-us-fat




TRIPLEMWF
Posts: 731
5/28/13 9:56 A

If I could like a response on here, I would like yours Russell over and over and over. You said everything that I was thinking only much more eloquently :)



JIMTHEATHEIST
Posts: 378
5/28/13 9:12 A

Russell,

Evolution does not take place over a time period of less than 100 years. The process I am talking about would be the one that started just after the last ice-age and around the time of the birth of agriculture. About 10,000 years ago, humans learned to store food and keep and raise livestock. We no longer needed to collect berries or hunt on a day to day basis. Our bodies have adapted to getting a steady supply of a given amount of carbohydrates, fats and proteins on a daily basis. That took 10,000 years.

Of course McDonalds kills us. It gives our bodies an unexpected amount of fats and carbs. That is not my point.

Evidence does support that our bodies adapt to climate and foods in a given climate. you need look no further than our neighbors in Canada and Mexico to see this. If you look even further, look at how the Asians have adapted to their local food supply.

We here in America, if we just use our heads, we can live a happy, healthy lifestyle given the foods in our climate. (I am not considering McDonalds a food source, but that should go unsaid.) I have many friends who are healthy, fit and happy. They do not need to count calories or worry about every bit of food like I do. They have always lived healthy where I on the other hand have not. I am paying for it. But, now I am on a road to recovery without a need for a "diet". I am just doing things I should have always done. I changed my life and I don't put trash in my body.

This was the reasoning behind my initial post. This is a forum of ideas. Mine is that "diets" don't work! No matter what you label them or what you call them. Listening to your body and your doctor will get you much further in your journey to a healthier happier lifestyle.

Good luck on your journey Russell, and keep sharing and spreading the Spark!



RUSSELL_40
Posts: 16,740
5/27/13 12:15 P

Jim, the diet we eat today was invented in the 1970's as heart disease and cancer rates started to climb. Of course, it had been about 80 years since we first got colas, and started processing our grains. So we doubled down, and started eating more sugar, and processed foods, switching to higher carb, and lower fat. In 40 years, we have not only failed to reverse the trend, we have accelerated it. Kids are getting diabetes( Type 2 ) in their teens now, something that was unusual till your 50's/or 60's. Cancer, and heart disease are normal now in your 30's and 40's.

So we have 2 stories. The other is about millions of years of humans not having processed foods, and thriving. Did they live as long as us? Hardly. However, they died of things we have eliminated today, like pneumonia, and starving, as well as being gored by their dinner. We no longer have these dangers to contend with, so we should healthier, but less prone to being killed by our dinner, or the common cold. The problem is the processed foods we eat. No one is against fruit, and vegetables, but cavemen didn't eat bread, noodles, or Cocoa Puffs. If they ate this way, we would not be here today. Now, we are sickly after our 40's, and kept functioning due to pills, and surgeries. That isn't an improvement.

My parents ate bacon and eggs for breakfast, and meat and fruits/vegetables for lunch/dinner. As a child my Dad was lucky to live on a farm, in the 1950's. In the city, the kids in town had more money, and ate at the new McDonald's in town. My Dad was 5'7" 145 lbs, and probably ate 2,500 calories a day. They not only used butter, but saved bacon fat to fry vegetables in, for flavor. My mother was a nurse in outstate New York in the 60's. In the 6 years she did that, the hospital had 1 case of a heart attack. Today, I doubt my local hospital goes any 24 hour period without one.

You say our bodies will adapt, but evidence proves otherwise. I do believe that we can adapt to eat different foods over time, but a lot of what we call food today, isn't real food. We can't adapt to it, ever. We haven't adapted, we have just gotten sicker, and the only reason it isn't even more obvious, is that science has limited the effects, due to health breakthroughs. So you get sick at 48, and they keep you alive for 30 years with pacemakers, pills, and a kidney transplant. Are you living a better life, just because you made it to 78? Hardly.

The idea that we eat meat, fruit, vegetables, eggs, and fats as we did for the millions of years that we thrived makes more sense than continuing what we have done for 1-3 generations, with horrible results.





JUSTEATREALFOOD
Posts: 993
5/27/13 11:26 A

Jim I didn't find your comments offensive, just confusing. As I believe the people that are eating a diet like paleo/primal are the ones who will benefit from natural selection. The current way of eating hasn't been around for long, maybe one lifetime. I know the over processed chemical laden foods and abundance of grainy carbohydrates and sugars that we have today are the main reason why people are so sick.

For myself there are foods that cause me digestive distress. Gluten containing grains are the worst, then corn, soy and most beans. I obviously have not adapted to eat those foods. So I think I'll stick to eating mostly vegetables, meats, fats and fruits for now as it seems to be working for me. I enjoy high energy levels and stable blood sugars which is great short term and I'm going to bet it will be great long term as well.

All the best to you,
April

Edited by: JUSTEATREALFOOD at: 5/27/2013 (11:27)


JIMTHEATHEIST
Posts: 378
5/27/13 10:57 A

AMANDARAQS:

Our bodies, like the bodies of all animals change over time. Those changes are brought on by gene flow, the climate we live in, the resources available in that climate and the competition for those resources. These are the driving forces behind Natural Selection. We (those of us in first world countries) now live in a time when resources are a plenty, competition is low and the climate is vastly different from that of our ancestors. I am not saying that the Paleo Diet would not work in the short term, Say even for a few years, but try as you might, you can not stop Evolution. Our bodies, whether we want them to or not, are changing to the conditions of the now. Undoing all the changes that have taken place over the past 10,000+ years can not be done in a single lifetime.

That said, I understand that the Paleo diet has helped a lot of people. Lots of diets have helped a lot of people. Atkins has helped a lot of people. Being a vegan has helped lots of people. Lots of people have also tried these diets with no success at all.

The Paleo diet I would argue is not a lifestyle change, it's a change in how and what you eat. A lifestyle change is a not just changing what you eat, it is changing what you do, how you live, how you think, how you interact with others. If you change your lifestyle, truly change your lifestyle, there is no "Falling off the wagon" or "Working on sticking to a routine". There is just living a new life.

I am happy for all the people that have seen health improvements by trying the Paleo diet. I am just one that does not see evidence that eating like our ancestors will help the human race long term.

I sincerely apologize if my remarks have offended anyone. These forums are a place of exchanging ideas and I was using it as such.

Good luck on your goals everyone and happy Sparking.



JILLYMAUI
Posts: 1,046
5/27/13 10:31 A


For me this food plan known as Paleo is helping to make me well. I am now OFF insulin. Repeat, I am OFF insulin, after being on insulin for years. 4 injections, up to 40 units per injection. And I got off it after 2 weeks of Paleo. Insulin was MISERABLE. So there is that.

Also the inflammation in my joints is much reduced and the puffy feeling, and tiredness is gone.
Also on Paleo I am not hungry, except when I have not eaten for hours and it is time to eat. For someone who struggles this is a big one.

My kidneys are not well, I have chronic kidney disease and this food plan is helping my kidney function. I eat only 12 oz of protein per day so as not to tax them further.

So to each their own, but for me Paleo is a lifestyle change I can manage a day at a time. It is not easy, but what food restriction plan is?
I feel better than I have in years and that makes this all worth it.
Paleo is for me.

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AMANDANCES
Posts: 1,975
5/26/13 11:07 P

Jimtheatheist: The Paleo "diet" IS a lifestyle change -- it's basically about eating low on the "food chain."

How do you figure natural selection weighs in on making Paleo unsustainable?



MEG-NATALIA07
Posts: 679
5/26/13 12:04 P

I do not follow Paleo eating strictly, have cut out most processed foods, and I limit grains (and stick to gluten free) and have incorporated much more meat and fresh produce into my diet. It feels great. I have a pinterest board (the link is below) with lots of recipes and photos. I like a blend, so it includes dairy. Best of luck to you as your journey to health continues!



JIMTHEATHEIST
Posts: 378
5/26/13 10:48 A

Natural Selection is one reason that would make the Paleo diet unsustainable in the long term. There are a number of factors that go into your overall health and well being. Paleo claims that our ancestors lived longer because of the foods they eat. While, there is some truth to this, it is also reasonable to assume that their heart, lung, kidneys and nervous system worked a bit differently from ours. not in the sense that they would be different, but that the environment back then was different and all living things tend to adapt to their environment. Our ancestors did not breath car exhaust, drink water with added fluoride, take vitamins, sleep on Sealy Posturepedic beds and go to chiropractors. But the main reason I would not do the Paleo Diet is because it has the word diet in it's name. Diets don't work in the long term. IMHO changing your lifestyle slowly overtime seems to be a better option.



JILLYMAUI
Posts: 1,046
5/25/13 9:44 P

Thank YOU!
It is really encouraging to read comments after I post something, WOW, I guess that is what Sparking is right??

Anyway, today was great, I had a big bbq to go to and I thought ok, what will be there to eat, so I brought a huge green salad with eggs in it and cherries so I knew there would be food I could eat.
And they grilled yummy food so I had a piece of chicken too and I was perfectly fine with my meal, paleo all the way. This is a huge relief, now I know how to go to a party (at least a potluck!)

Thanks again, and I know

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AMANDANCES
Posts: 1,975
5/24/13 11:54 A

I really really did NOT want the Paleo or Primal diet to work, because I'm so crazy over bread! And I'm still not ready to commit fully, cause bread has a symbolic role in our family meals.

But ...

When I was pregnant they were worried I was developing gestation diabetes, so I was told to eat some protein with my fruit, and to make an effort to avoid or cut back on certain foods (high glycemix-index, I think.) I did and I felt fine and did not end up developing diabetes, so yay.

Cut to 18 months after the birth and I felt like I needed a diet change. So for about a month I went back to those pregnancy ways -- eating a little roast chicken with my fruit breakfast, avoiding a good deal of bread and pasta, and really ending a lot more protein than normal.

I FELT FABULOUS! It was amazing how much energy I had. I could get through an entire Tae Bo bootcamp 50 minute workout dvd without feeling like I was going to fall over from either exhaustion or starvation, and I didn't feel bloated of puffy or like I was retaining water.

So like a dolt, I gave up that kind of diet and went back to pastas and bread ... and tiredness, lethargy, etc.

I don't want to admit it to myself, but I don't think bread is my friend :(

As with anything, moderation is the key, but no matter how much I want to dislike low-carb diet plans, or how silly I want to believe Paleo is, I can't help but think that it actually made me feel a lot better. Your mileage may vary.

If I tried limiting or giving up dairy along with the carbs, I'd probably be able to leap tall buildings or something, but come on... it's CHEESE. And Cheese is good :) LOL.



RUSSELL_40
Posts: 16,740
5/24/13 10:17 A

Congrats Triple, on better health, and reaching Onederland. Sometimes the health benefits are not the desire, but are a great added bonus, that we never expect.Soon, you may get another added benefit.. a shopping spree!



TRIPLEMWF
Posts: 731
5/24/13 10:08 A

I'm following more of a Primal diet, because I just love cheese too much LOL

I'm probably following it about 90%, I'm just not ready to give up my artificial sweetners just yet.

I recommend the book Primal BluePrint by Mark Sisson and Practical Paleo by Diane Sanfilippo. Both have great information and are good for beginners.

I lost 15lbs in a month changing my way of eating.

Plus, some added benefits that I didn't expect! My skin is the best its ever been, I have no symptoms of my IBS and I no longer take my daily heartburn medication. I sleep great, and haven't had any issues with low blood sugar like I use to.



RUSSELL_40
Posts: 16,740
5/24/13 8:13 A

Congrats Jilly. I have had similar results with Atkins. I started 4 years ago, due to threats of having to use insulin. I had been diabetic for 7 years, and was around 350 lbs, and many days 350 blood sugar. I was on 2000 mg Metformin, and an Amaryl pill in the morning.

It took 1 year for them to cancel all my pills, due to low blood sugars weekly. Since then my A1C has never been over 5.4. For 3 entire years. I don't think you ever get over diabetes, but if you aren't taking pills, and your blood sugars stay normal, that is good enough, right?

I think you will find other health benefits too. I have CHF, and high blood pressure, and all of the pills I take for them has been halved too. My cholesterol is down to 104, and I quit the pill for that too. My BP is 100/65.

I just wanted to let you know that I know dozens of people who have had similar results doing low carb ( Atkins/Paleo ), and at 33 days, you will become even healthier, both weight wise, and inside your body as time goes on. Hopefully you reach all your goals.

I have never understood why low carb isn't the treatment for diabetics. They cut your carbs in half, because carbs spike blood sugars, but cutting them in half again is dangerous? It isn't, and due to limited carbs, we eat a lot better choices of those carbs, and I think get better nutrition from 75 grams a day, than most people eating 300 grams.

Keep us updated, and if you start getting low blood sugars a lot, push your doctor to get you off those pills, offer to get tested more often if the doctor is nervous. Doctors are very reluctant to cut a pill, so they won't do so until you are ready to not take it, but probably months after you could be off it. They always think it is a fluke.








JUSTEATREALFOOD
Posts: 993
5/24/13 7:16 A

Wow that's amazing Jilly! I am so glad you have found something that is working for you. Done with insulin injections in 33 days, that's just astounding! It really shows the healing power of food.

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JILLYMAUI
Posts: 1,046
5/24/13 4:57 A

Today will be day 33 of paleo, and it has been great. When I began I was injecting insulin (alot of it) 4 times every day. Now I am DONE with insulin, I am not having to inject at all anymore.
And I am taking half my oral. This is amazing, I have normal blood sugars now.

I feel alot better, the inflammation is much less and I do not feel tired so much. I began swimming and aquacize too about the same time, so that helps.

Paleo is not easy, I have not taken 1 meal off, or eaten anything non paleo. I want to not have diabetes anymore, or at least have good blood sugar all the time.

I love Paleo for the health benefits, now we will see if I can lose weight too. But I don't get on the scale.
So it will be awhile. If I weigh and have not lost much I do not want to get discouraged so I will refrain from weighing....






SARAHEGILROY
SparkPoints: (11,239)
Fitness Minutes: (801)
Posts: 181
4/23/13 6:24 P

Also check out my Pinterest board here pinterest.com/sarahgilroy/paleo-low-carb-g
luten-free/

Some other great sites for recipes are www.paleomg.com (I use this one a ton!) www.everydaypaleo.com and www.elanaspantry.com



SARAHEGILROY
SparkPoints: (11,239)
Fitness Minutes: (801)
Posts: 181
4/23/13 6:18 P

We started in October. I did really well at first. Then in December somehow the 80/20 rule turned into 20/80. My own fault for giving in all the time. It's been a struggle to get back to it full time. We still eat a lot of Primal meals, but next week we are shifting back full force.



JILLYMAUI
Posts: 1,046
4/23/13 5:34 P

May I ask how long you have been on this paleo? I am on day 2 ! We will see how it goes, thank you so much for writing!

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JILLYMAUI
Posts: 1,046
4/23/13 5:32 P

Thank YOU, I ran across that word Primal, right now this is day 2 for me, it ain't easy but I am giving it a try, it helps to plan out what I am having and so I have the rest of my meals planned today. I am very grateful for your info too~

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SARAHEGILROY
SparkPoints: (11,239)
Fitness Minutes: (801)
Posts: 181
4/23/13 5:19 P

Look up www.marksdailyapple.com It has a lot of good info. Mark is Primal which is Paleo, just not as strict. A lot of people still have some dairy. Basically, he says figure out what works for you. If some dairy works have it. If no dairy is best for you great. Primal also follows the 80/20 rule. Paleo didn't make much sense to me till I found Primal.



MIRANDAFRM2
Posts: 290
4/23/13 3:43 P

I just read the book and am trying to stay away from the grains and dairy. I think it is great to cut the sodium out, I don't think I can stick to it 100% of the time but so far I like eating lean meats, fruits and vegtables. To be honest the things I miss the most are beans, I thought it would be cheese.



YOJULEZ
SparkPoints: (15,605)
Fitness Minutes: (120)
Posts: 2,171
4/23/13 12:18 P

My mom has been doing a modified paleo... primal maybe? Basically eliminating grains. She still eats dairy. She's lost 5lbs so far. She is in her 60s. My nurse practitioner had told me that many older women benefit from eliminating grains from their diet. Now, maybe my mom is losing weight because eliminating the grains (she had bread at least twice a day) caused her calorie counts to go down, who knows. But, it's worth a shot. She also noticed that her sodium count went way down after eliminating grains, since there's a lot of hidden sodium in bread.

I have a few friends that follow a strict Paleo diet... they seem to like it but they also do extensive workouts so they benefit a lot from the high protein. I know I couldn't do it, I have no desire to give up my cheese :)



MANDIETERRIER1
Posts: 13,489
4/23/13 10:03 A

Its not for me, but maybe it will work for you.

Read lots of books and see if it is something you can do for the rest of your life.



JUSTEATREALFOOD
Posts: 993
4/23/13 9:47 A

Not paleo here either but close to it.

Real whole foods. Lots and lots of vegetables especially green ones and I include starchy tubers, grass fed pastured meats, healthy fats, eggs, some fruit and some raw grass fed pastured dairy.

I feel fantastic and my body composition is the best it's ever been.

Sean Croxton's podcast is a great place to start for info on eating real food. He's has 214 Episodes on I Tunes.

undergroundwellness.com/radio/



DIDS70
Posts: 5,070
4/23/13 9:29 A

Not Paleo per se, but I eat raw. I have felt wonderful. Though I know it is not a diet plan for everyone, I find it satifying, fulfilling, and nutritously applicable to my life.



123ELAINE456
SparkPoints: (142,329)
Fitness Minutes: (46,599)
Posts: 84,203
4/23/13 6:04 A

I know a Baseball Wife was on it and like it very well. I have been thinking of trying it Myself. Look on the Internet and see what You can find out about it. God Blessings to Everyone. Have a Wonderful Week. Take Care.





CMCOLE
Posts: 2,667
4/23/13 5:07 A

seems to be plenty of discussions and questions lately - do a search in the messages and you'll likely find some info and lots of opinions.

villagegreennetwork.com/spring-e-book-bund
le/?AFFID=119539




DETOX55
SparkPoints: (1,070)
Fitness Minutes: (2,397)
Posts: 100
4/23/13 3:49 A

Sorry...wouldn't touch it. Over promises and unsustainable...

Please try and find something you enjoy and can stay with for life....



JILLYMAUI
Posts: 1,046
4/23/13 3:26 A

I am going to try paleo, its brand new to me and I am diabetic, I am hoping it will help.

Anyone else here doing Paleo???

Would love to learn more too

Thanks

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