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SPARK_COACH_JEN Posts: 56,715
2/27/12 3:53 P

I think the strategy to "agree to disagree" is a good one. I'd ask that the back and forth please stop.

Thanks,

Coach Jen

CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 3:18 P

'That's not what Sparkpeople's about, and not why I'm here' *blink*

DRAGONCHILDE SparkPoints: (57,496)
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2/27/12 3:14 P

If you say so.

CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 3:11 P

You like arguing but you pretend you don't like it.

DRAGONCHILDE SparkPoints: (57,496)
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2/27/12 3:10 P

I don't really understand what you just said just then?

CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 3:07 P

"I'm not in the mood to argue with you" then continuing arguing.
Taking the 'science' on your back.
I disagree with you again :) especially with "agree" part.

DRAGONCHILDE SparkPoints: (57,496)
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2/27/12 2:56 P

I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree. You've pretty consistently missed the point of every post I've made, and I'm not in the mood to argue with you. That's not what Sparkpeople's about, and not why I'm here. You make a lot of claims with no references to to back you up, and seem to be contrary to the science I've read, so I don't see the point of continuing to argue.

Edited by: DRAGONCHILDE at: 2/27/2012 (15:01)
CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 2:32 P

Nope honey is not a poison. Neither sugar is. The body biochemically treat them as toxins. Like alcohol.

CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 2:30 P

I disagree with "honey is healthier". Nope, it is the same. Actually sugar and sugar containing products do not cure cancer, they feed cancer cells. Saying "honey is better" is advocating.

(By the way it tastes better than sugar) :)

BITTERQUILL Posts: 1,370
2/27/12 2:01 P

"Advocating honey with its nutritional properties can make people to think it is safe to eat."

I totally see what you're saying about people sometimes getting the wrong message when someone talks about the nutritional benefits of foods that don't really have a whole lot going for them. I agree with you that it's irresponsible to say "honey is totally healthy" without qualifying that it is highly caloric and made entirely of sugar, which should generally minimized. But nobody here is doing that. It's *also* irresponsible to claim that honey is some sort of poison when it's not, because that's just plain misinformation.

As -POOKIE- said, honey is basically empty calories that you could (and should) spend on something nutritious instead. I agree with you on that, 100%. But DRAGONCHILDE's point about moderation is a valid one, too. Just as it's not good to imply that honey is great for you, it's not necessary to scare people away from eating it if they are doing it carefully. Honey *is* "safe to eat," to use your terminology. It's just not safe to *abuse.*

"People think agave is fine. No, it is sugar. It is better to track sugar allowance instead of the source."

It's *definitely* better to track the total grams rather than the source, that's true, since sugar is sugar. As for whether a certain source is "fine," I guess your definition of "fine" is just closer to my definition of "ideal." Yes, agave it's sugar. Yes, it should be minimized or even eliminated. But people who *do* use it do not necessarily abuse it, and won't necessarily experience any ill effects. I would consider small amounts "fine" (meaning acceptable), just not "ideal."

Just to clarify, I really do think it's great that you have decided to eliminate added sugar from your diet. It's great that you want to encourage other people to do the same. But scare tactics aren't necessary. Implying that honey is "unsafe" or that it's not ever acceptable to eat agave? That's a scare tactic, whether it's intentional or not.

Edited by: BITTERQUILL at: 2/27/2012 (14:21)
DRAGONCHILDE SparkPoints: (57,496)
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2/27/12 1:41 P

I don't think anyone here is advocating anything. The original poster asked about honey; we answered the question. Honey is not "unsafe" to eat. It is a sugar, yes, and I believe everyone including myself who has commented pointed out that you do, indeed, need to monitor it.

It's nice that you don't like it, but please remember that not everyone shares your views on the matter. Implying that we're advocating unsafe eating practices is unfair and not reading what we've written.

If you are given two choices, sugar or honey, honey is healthier. That doesn't mean you should start chugging gallons of the stuff or expect it to cure cancer.

CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 1:36 P

Advocating honey with its nutritional properties can make people to think it is safe to eat. It's properties are close to sugar. We do not need justification. If you like it that's fine.
Same as agave. People think agave is fine. No, it is sugar. It is better to track sugar allowance instead of the source.

BITTERQUILL Posts: 1,370
2/27/12 1:27 P

CLEVENT, it's your right to be opposed to *any* amount of *any* kind of sugar. Sure, sugar is absolutely unnecessary and not ideal. But if someone eats a diet of whole, fresh, healthy foods and *occasionally* consumes a teaspoon of honey, they aren't going to immediately become a diabetic or gain 50 pounds. As long as their overall sugar intake is low and their caloric and macronutrient balances are good, a healthy person can have *small* amounts of honey (or even regular sugar) without worry.

Nobody is advocating irresponsible use of honey, just pointing out that it is a *slightly* better choice than refined sugar, in some cases.

TONSERS SparkPoints: (37,989)
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2/27/12 1:24 P

I drink caffeinated green tea in the mornings or early afternoon. Any later than that I switch to herbal teas only.

Honey, like anything, is fine in moderation. It is just sugar though - so you should be careful if you are counting your calories.

DRAGONCHILDE SparkPoints: (57,496)
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2/27/12 1:19 P

Yes. And I'm seeing the same nutrient levels there. :)

CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 1:18 P

Sparkpeople can be used as a quick reference, but more reliable information is given in Nutrition Data pages.
nutritiondata.self.com/facts/sweets/5568/2


CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 1:17 P

Even if we eat a cup of honey the nutritional values of some nutrients does not pass significance mark. This means negligable.
Plus the sugar brings high glycemic load and inflammatory properties to honey.
I am not even bringing the dental 'benefits' of honey.

MPLANE37 SparkPoints: (65,234)
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2/27/12 12:55 P

Green tea is great to have. The only problem is that it is an acquired taste, so one should try it a sufficient number of times, with the variants that are not too strong in the beginning. I remember that I had a hard time getting used the taste of green tea, although I was used to having black tea or herbal tea.

DRAGONCHILDE SparkPoints: (57,496)
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2/27/12 12:47 P

Clevent, if you look at the nutrition information here at Sparkpeople, you'll see it. The nutrients are NOT in huge amounts, but they're there. It's not something I'm imagining. ;) I wouldn't write home to mom, since it's almost trace, but there's no denying that something's in there. Heck, there's even carbs (which, contrary to popular belief, are not evil, and our body kinda NEEDS to function)

Edited by: DRAGONCHILDE at: 2/27/2012 (13:01)
BITTERQUILL Posts: 1,370
2/27/12 12:42 P

These are true teas in order of age/fermentation: white, green, oolong (wu long), black, pur-eh. They are all fine even if if they contain caffeine, although total caffeine intake should generally be monitored if you get a lot. There are all kinds of health claims for green and oolong teas, with varying degrees of authenticity, but if nothing else they are certainly not *un*healthy.

Then there are herbal teas, which include yerba mate teas, rooibos teas (red tea) and the more common herbal infusions, which are made from all kinds of plants and herbs. Some of these have benefits specific to the plant source (such as chamomile being soothing at night, peppermint and ginger calming the stomach etc).

You can count whatever liquid you choose as water, if you want to. Tea is 99% water, after all. There are recommended upper limits on caffeine intake, artificially sweetened beverage intake, sugared beverage intake etc. But that doesn't change the fact that their chemical makeup is based in water.

A little bit of honey won't hurt your health or your weight loss. The benefit to honey is that it contains small amounts of micronutrients and a potential for allergy protection (if you eat local honey), which refined sugar does not. It's eating sugars to excess that causes issues, not eating them at all. If you eat a lot of processed foods that contain added sugar, those will generally do a lot more damage than adding a small amount of honey to your tea. You *do* have to be just as careful with it as you would be with refined sugar, however. Calories are calories, and sugar is sugar. But if you're choosing between a teaspoon of honey and a teaspoon of sugar, honey is often the better choice.

Edited by: BITTERQUILL at: 2/27/2012 (12:52)
NEED2MOVE2 Posts: 1,128
2/27/12 10:56 A

Peppermint tea is good to. I find I like a tea in the evening before bed.

CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 10:53 A

For some reason I do not see any of these nutrients on their labels.
Only benefit of honey comes from local honey. It is actually a pollen allergy shot.
There is nothing else. Just empty calories.

DRAGONCHILDE SparkPoints: (57,496)
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2/27/12 10:46 A

Honey has fewer calories than sugar, and a small amount of nutrients (it's not actually "empty calories") but you do have to be careful with it, as you do with ANY sweetener. I eat a lot of honey; I prefer the taste to sugar, and I just can't get on board with low-cal sweeteners. It's actually helped me lose weight. Instead of going for a candy bar or a 100 cal snack, I drink a cup of tea with a tablespoon of honey. That's 64 calories, instead of 100 or more!

It's just a food like any other. Moderation is key!

-POOKIE- Posts: 11,848
2/27/12 10:39 A

honey is just sugar in another form, people will claim various benefits, but at the end of the day if you are watching calories... they are empty sugar calories that are better "spent" on food with actual nutritional value.

Try a few brands of green tea, they really do vary, find one you enjoy the most!

CLEVENT SparkPoints: (42,161)
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2/27/12 10:15 A

I suggest you buy full leaf green tea. I like starbucks tazo teas. It is called China Green Tips. It does not need sweetening if you grow a taste for it.

TRYINGHARD54 Posts: 3,634
2/27/12 5:37 A

green tea is good for you.. Probably should be decaf... Honey is ok in moderation just like anything else.

NEWFORTE SparkPoints: (311)
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Posts: 21
2/27/12 5:18 A

Is it alright to drink green tea ? Should it be decaffeinated or regular ? Are there any benefits to one or the other ? Would it be in addition to 8 cps of water a day ???

Thanks for your help, and sorry if it has been answered before. New here and learning the ropes.

Also, any news on honey, since it is a sugar, do you have to be careful with it ?

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