This makes me happy; intelligent and reasonable conversation about a topic that could've been turned upside down had the perpetrators shown up...
Fitness Minutes: (41,592)
4,493 4/26/13 10:09 A
I agree, Mandie & Bunny. Received a snarky reply more than once when just trying to help (or that's how I took it).
when it gets to the point that I get really upset by something said on a message board, I know it's time to take a break. Life is too short and there are much more important things in the world than an online argument, KWIM?
Slightly off-topic but a big pet peeve of mine, is when a poster asks for advice/information,
and upon receiving said advice/information, if it doesn't jibe with what they hoped to hear,
responds like this:
"I didn't ask for a lecture kthxbai"
Oooooooooooooo i just HATE that. Had it happen to me (and a few others) awhile back on a thread asking advice on how to keep track of calories when your child is always picking food off your plate. Understandably, the advice tended to be along the lines of "don't let her pick off your plate" "wean her onto her own plate" "tell her no this is mommy's" "put a little extra on the edge of your plate for her to pick from" - stuff like that. Response was a VERY hot "I didn't ask for parenting advice" reply. -facepalm-
I mean ok, sometimes you get advice that is a) stupid b) inappropriate c) not what you wanted to hear and/or d) something you're going to ignore/not act upon. But a person could be a little gracious, right? The responders TOOK TIME OUT OF THEIR DAY to make suggestions in an attempt to HELP. Doesn't hurt to say "thanks for the feedback."
I generally respond to posts that I (or someone I know) have experienced. I will let them know what happened.
I totally pass by (or not respond to) the new science on "this new pill or potion or lotion". Hog wash!
I will NOT be cruel though, no matter what mood I am in. I once reponded to a thread and said something on a post like "we all struggle with weight in some way" (something to that effect) and got back a nasty response about "you don't know me or that I struggle with weight and how dare you say that". And it was not the original poster who said that, just someone random. If there is something I don't want to air in the open, I'll send the person a private message.
Fitness Minutes: (41,592)
4,493 4/25/13 2:54 P
It's shocking how many people do not double-check the information they hear. This one went around at my work a couple years ago, "Grambo" the gun-toting grandma who took justice into her own hands (graphic content warning, for those who may be inclined to click) www.snopes.com/crime/justice/grambo.asp>
This one "got" even the head of our organization - a HIGHLY educated, EXTREMELY intelligent, competent, worldly man. That required some really delicate debunking (you don't just tell The Boss's Boss's Boss he's "Wrong" heh).
And - Luc? WHaaaaatttt??? Can't you just tell your professor "To heck with your peer reviewed research - I know what I see with my own eyes!" Who'da thunk they'd be so particular. lol.
Fitness Minutes: (41,592)
4,493 4/25/13 10:36 A
I won't lose all that weight and look like Pink by the end of May??? WHAT?
dang! Shoulda invested in those rasperry ketones instead
not so much on the threads, but for the longest time I was the one who would reply with a Snopes link to those stupid chain emails that make the rounds. My dad & one very good friend get snookered by every one of them. And send them to everybody in their contact list. Now I just delete without reading. After a year or two it becomes really obvious they are happy forwarding partial truths and nothing is going to change that
Definitely if one is going to post anything fact based then they need to have the facts to back it up.
Everything I post is from my opinion and personal experience. And I usually state that it is my opinion or personal experience
Fitness Minutes: (6,555)
2,345 4/25/13 10:27 A
In college, if you didn't have facts to support your argument we were ripped apart by the professor and our classmates (and justifiably so). I apply the same logic here. I don't say anything fact based unless I have the sources to support it and know the pros and cons of those sources (biases, weaknesses, etc).
It is very hard to convey tone and the meaning behind words on a message board.
I used to try and debunk threads, but I don't really do it anymore. Unless I am feeling sassy. It is just not worth the energy it takes to disagree. When the person wants someone to agree with them. Telling them that the $700 they just spent on miracle pills and shakes will cause them to drop 70 lbs in two days and they will look like a body builder in a week.
I can only post from my personal experience. Or try to get somebody to see a point from another perspective. And sometimes I have found that I just have to walk away from a thread. Some people will see any disagreement as bullying or arguing.
Fitness Minutes: (11,285)
3,116 4/25/13 10:09 A
You are right. I should not have criticized a responder. From now on I will keep my opinions about responses to myself. Sorry
Fitness Minutes: (76,885)
2,953 4/24/13 7:57 P
BUNNYKICKS - Exactly! Even those who respond critically of what other posters write look bad, if one replies to that post, they look even worse! I tend to avoid those threads like the plague. Thanks for succinctly adding to my original post!
" I really do find it annoying when people criticize other answers to the posts."
Yeah. This. There's a thread I can think of right now, upon which anyone who holds an alternate opinion to the OP is being labelled as "not having done their research" or "not being observant" or "not understanding" etc. etc. Which - that's just not the case at all. The opposing opinions are based in their own research and analysis; it's a difference in PERSONAL PHILOSOPHY, not a difference in "truth."
It also includes a significant amount of very judgmental, bigoted, stigmatizing and condescending commentary. But... what do you do? Argue it? Pointless. So, the comments can stand; all it does is make the writer of them look bad. Or, such is my opinion.
Fitness Minutes: (76,885)
2,953 4/24/13 7:26 P
I respond to threads that interest me and wherein I have experience with what is being stated by the poster.
Basically, if you ask me a question, I will give you an answer to your question. Yet some posters are merely looking for those who agree with their own views and others just want to get the discussion going and are truly looking for varying opinions. The point being is you need to find out which direction prior to answering the question.
I do believe that everyone is entitled to their opinion but I really do find it annoying when people criticize other answers to the posts. The idea is to get a wide variety of opinions whether you agree with someone or not.
SHERYLDS gave an excellent couple of responses to this thread! There were some that I didn't like but who am I to criticize the writers of those posts as the original question isn't asking what I think about what other people answered, it is asking what I think.
POINT TO REMEMBER: Email is the lowest form of communication.
I've also run into people who have nothing to offer and enjoy the result of slamming someone and then just watching the sharks feed. they find It entertaining; they sit back and watch. sort of like FOX news does
Edited by: SHERYLDS at: 4/24/2013 (13:05)
Fitness Minutes: (41,592)
4,493 4/24/13 12:54 P
sometimes folks dig their heels in and have no interest in any other point of view
as The Bloggess says, "When your wrong, your wrong" (that's actually a comment from a reader who vehemently disagreed with her. She put his words on a t-shirt.)
I am curious... what is the purpose of critiquing other people instead of contributing your own ideas. Does it add to the 'conversation'? If you disagree with someone's opinion all you have to do is offer your own views.
there are better ways to keep a discussion going. show how much more valid your view point is, versus theirs.
I let go the thought that I am "open-minded" long ago when I started to realize that THAT phrase is relevant to whomever is stating it.
Funny, I remember once (many years ago) a girl at a party I was attending said she likes all kinds of music then proceeds to list the exceptions....it was a long darn list! Open-mindedness is okay as long as it fits ones narrative.
Fitness Minutes: (11,285)
3,116 4/24/13 11:39 A
Well here goes. Why would anyone say she believes she has a more open mind than most? I find that a very offensive way to start a post. It really does not entice me to keep reading the rest of it. Maybe I am not as open minded as I thought I was. I really do enjoy exchanging ideas and listening to others' views.
I think the CAFE is a fun place to exchange views and challenge what we think. If people join in with an open mind they can learn from (or teach) others. It's all about delivery. Stirring the pot (when tactfully done) is a good thing . We just need to accept that people have different perceptions on what they read, and not everyone knows how to express themselves.
Edited by: SHERYLDS at: 4/24/2013 (10:58)
Fitness Minutes: (41,592)
4,493 4/24/13 10:03 A
if it's something I feel strongly about, I will definitely post an opposing view.
If I have no dog in the fight...meh, why bother? I don't post just to antagonize.
and if it's something that really does not interest me, even if I bother to read the thread, I won't voice my opposing opinion or my thought that those who are interested in that topic are focused on the wrong thing.
Ok, so what if my general approach to conversing is more along the lines of "I speak my mind" and am unable to do otherwise because it goes against what I believe in? Should I just not post or should I chime-in? Be damned what others think or what trouble I may stir-up, right?
Hmmm, KJ, this has me thinking....it's making my head hurt this early in the morning!
I agree with a previous poster who said they try to discern whether the person is really seeking information or just wanting confirmation of what they're already doing. I try to tread lightly, especially if the OP is new to spark.
My biggest problem is with those who post a contradictory opinion or try to disprove the OP and do so in a way that shouts "you are such a dumb***!" between the lines. That automatically closes the mind of the OP and then it usually degenerates into slamming and a deleted post--and thus a lost opportunity to actually share some knowledge. It just seems so childish.
Fitness Minutes: (14,252)
9,666 4/24/13 8:22 A
Justeatrealfood, that ain't a pissing match. ;) Hang around a while... you'll see some doozies. The hCG diet ones are spectacular.
Fitness Minutes: (40)
995 4/24/13 7:57 A
Some define "open mind" the ability to accept, be willing to believe, adopt and have "faith" in some new product or idea somebody sings the praises about. To me, that is something else entirely.
An open mind is a willingness to listen to the views of others who often do not agree with you, and consider what they say. It gets me nowhere in life but my philosophy has always been to acknowledge parts of someone's opinion and views that I don't wholly agree with, or even mostly disagree with. I feel that most people in my world get very defensive if you don't agree with them fully! I never present my opinion in a "slamming way" though I think there may have been a few times in my life the recipient took it that way.
Politics is the absolute worst! I am an educator and in it seems to me in my early schooling years my teachers told me to think for myself and use my own mind to form opinions rather than just latching on to the opinions of those I love or admire. I have always done this. I am in the field of education and feel I am in the minority of daring to think differently than the collective wisdom of the day. I believe most of my colleagues are closed minded though they would never in a million years recognize this in themselves.
Nowadays in my field, the catch phrase is "best practices." And they are most certainly pushed on us as best practices, requirements if we want to stay employed. Even though I can produce research that shows the studies these "best practices" policies are based on, are seriously flawed, it makes no difference and I will not be heard.
I don't think I am one to "poke" an OP but if they ask for an opinion, I will sometimes give mine, whether it is agreement or not.
I am 54 years old and I can honestly say that over the years, yes, my opinions have changed on certain issues and topics based on me having an open mind and listening to evidence that might be counter to what my former opinion was based on. I love a good discussion where ideas and respectful opinions are shared. I hate nasty, slamming, arguments and offensive/defensive back and forth posting goes on in forums sometimes.
When I answer a post I try to give a helpful opinion based on years of reading, research and practice, without being too wordy. I practice what I preach and have the results to show it.
Often times my research tells me a different story from the standard answer one might receive from a source such as the USDA who's job is to sell more food. If they were the Department of Wellness and Health I might pay more attention to their recommendations.
That said, I know that we are all unique and what works for me may not work for someone else. So all I can do is tell my truth and hope to help someone. I try not to get into pissing matches, but it has happened before, eh Dragonchilde? And It may happen again. That's something I'm working on.
It's sad. There seems to be a general trend in this country, not just on SP, to either disregard the thoughts, ideas, or opinions of others, or outright slam them. IMHO, there are many right answers to most questions or problems. To be able to creatively think about and discuss solutions provides not only interesting dialog, but also can provide great answers to issues. In addition, what is the right solution for one person may well not be the right answer for others.
I mostly ignore people's slams or put-downs. It says everything about being closed minded, and nothing about being supportive. I see SP as a place to support and elevate; not to belittle the ideas or suggestions of others.
Fitness Minutes: (88,126)
11,738 4/24/13 5:38 A
There was a person posting that I thought, just my opinion, was pushing their opinion/knowlege down our throats. I got a little snarky with him twice, I haven't seen a post from him since. I felt a little bad about doing it but just couldn't take it anymore.
Fitness Minutes: (14,252)
9,666 4/24/13 12:13 A
It depends on the post in question. If it's shouting the praises of the fad of the week, be it a diet, a supplement, or whatever, I'm going to say my piece about it, share the real science, and hope to God someone reads it, with the understanding that they probably won't, since their minds are usually quite closed.
Unfortunately, some people really can't cope with an opposing opinion.Too often, me and others are accused of being "negative" simply because we disagreed with the premise ofthe thread, even if backed up by SP experts!
Fitness Minutes: (19,628)
563 4/23/13 10:15 P
I guess I try to discern the purpose of the OP. If they're trying to convince me of something that I don't agree with, I probably won't respond. If I think they're asking a legitimate question or seem seriously misguided but open to suggestions, I am more likely to give my opinion.
I'm not here to get into fights. All of us see things differently and do things our own way, and I don't see my purpose here on SP to make everyone think the way I do.
Fitness Minutes: (73,446)
40,541 4/23/13 8:38 P
Here is some static from me...it does not matter how you reply, there is always someone with a very thin skin that is taking a reply post as a personal attack.
When a thread asks "what do you think of..." I tend to take it as an open invitation to share what I think....
Though I have come to understand that sometimes, the actual question being asked is "don't you agree with what i'm saying?" In which case, I would be better off just skipping over the thread entirely.
It hasn't taken me very long to learn that I should NEVER open a thread asking "what do you think of [fad diet]?" because the opening post is invariably "I have just bought 400 dollars worth of Magical Pills and I'm So Excited! Please Tell Me What Your Successes Have Been With These!" and they really REALLY don't want me responding "it's a scam."
I also do try to avoid the extremely-personal-delicate-subject type of threads, you just know they are going to end badly with hurt feelings... I've seen it a few times in the Cafe, and I've only been around for 3 months or so......
the more I participate in threads...the more I realize that some people aren't comfortable with an opposing opinion. Some folks get very defensive. I'm never sure if it's a matter of miscommunication or misinterpretation I just don't appreciate slamming. It isn't necessary. I have to remind myself that our spark community is so diverse in so many ways. You never know what to expect
If the topic is something that means enough to mean, then I don't mind going against the trend. However, I see a lot on these boards that I either don't care about, don't agree with, don't like, whatever. Most of the time I just keep on going right past it. I will stand my ground forever if it's something that I truly believe in, or care about. I don't like starting an argument just for the sake of an argument. I know a lot of people do, and I typically ignore those people too. I think most of the time, I just don't care enough to waste my time on whatever it is. I have enough of my own to worry about. I can't and don't want to spent all my energy worrying about what everyone else is worrying about.
This is kind of a pet peeve & rehabilitation issue rolled into one. I use to LOOOOOOOOOVE trying to take the outside angle to threads be they true inquiries or total BS or I'd at least like to "poke" at the O.P. (original poster) if I thought what were saying didn't fit my narrative.....yes, I was "one of THOSE a$$hats"
I suppose some could make an argument that I'm still somewhat like that now but you'd have to consider WHO would be saying that.
Anyway, what about you? When you read a thread or post that may not fit exactly into your own paradigm do YOU take it upon yourself to go at it at a different angle than others? Maybe stand behind a "principle" that you're speaking on behalf of the uninformed so YOU must save others from a poster's opinion?
I have posted time & again on various topics and most of them come and go; some stick around for a long while like my thread about being old enough to remember stuff to me posting the SP Posting guidelines (that went SOUTH asap because I think it hit too many nerves and it wasn't negative enough to have staying power) and there have been folks who rather than "discuss" just come SLAMMING down on me (I don't care because I slam back) or would simply take my words (and others, too) out of context and twist them all around.
When I did that I was of that mind that I did not/WOULD NOT be pigeon-holed into any one or several categories and that I was unique had my own path (not true as it turns out, we're ALL a lot more alike than one would think).
What say you?
btw - this thread is a "primer" to a subject that COULD be serious....otherwise its just more static coming from me.
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