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DOWNEASTB Posts: 472
7/1/12 8:26 A

JWoolman: It's early in the AM and I'm a little foggy-headed right now, but to (partially) answer your questions: Oats, rice, and corn cause insulin spikes. Starting last year my eating strategy was to cut down if not completely avoid any foods that raised insulin. Not only did I lose a lot of weight but my fasting blood sugar went down as well.

Generally I avoid anything with gluten or gluten substitutes, as the latter often contains undesirable starches. Sometimes I miss breads and pasta but not enough to mess with the pretend stuff, which is also expensive. Easier to just turn away altogether and get my carbs from vegetables instead.

Finally, I have heard various low-carb/Paleo/Primal etc. advocates state that they will eat the older Einkorn variety of wheat if it is sprouted. Hope this helps.

HOUNDLOVER1 Posts: 8,869
6/30/12 11:06 P

I believe soy may be just as dangerous as wheat unfortunately. I have stopped eating almost all grains and legumes and have to say I really don't miss them. My body is doing fantastic on a low-carb diet that's based on veggies, some fruit, nuts, meat and dairy. No more food cravings, no more brain fog, no more sleep disturbances, no more lack of energy in the afternoon.

NANNURSECHAMP SparkPoints: (2,269)
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6/30/12 11:03 A

An article popped up on Medscape a few days ago. Not all food is created equally. I came here for support. We are all in the weight loss battle. If it works for you continue. If it does not work keep looking and you will find a way to lose that works for you. I have struggled 15 years.. I finally found wheat belly and it works for me. I eat Nabisco Shredded wheat and within an hour I am shaking and nauseated. So I switched to Kashi shredded wheat and had same reaction. I tried wheat belly my knee pain went away. I started wheat again and I was in pain. It may be a sensitivity. who knows. Why pay a MD big bucks. when I know my body best.I would caution that my niece went on soy and she got dealthly ill from that. So in some cases any food can cause an issue. Find what works and stick to it.

JWOOLMAN SparkPoints: (2,343)
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4/23/12 3:35 P

SEACRONE: "Why is a "researcher" more qualified to present an argument against wheat than a medical doctor?" [followed by other good stuff about the need for being your own detective and researcher...]

Medical doctors are a tad overrated, in my experience. I taught pre-meds and was on the pre-med committee, and they were overwhelmingly the most close-minded group of kids I've ever seen. Very narrow focus,and if they decided something was true at the age of 17 then it was true forever. No amount of logic could shake them. It was very hard teaching them physics for that reason (and then there was the very annoying grade grubbing...). The percentage who did not fit into the "blinders on" category pretty much fits the percentage of M.D.s that I've run into who also are open-minded and willing to experiment and actually listen and ask relevant questions rather than just hand you a prescription after two minutes. This is a cultural thing, somehow that personality type/whatever got established in the US medical community and at some point, that's who is attracted to the profession.

Researchers likewise can be good or bad, but they are probably much more likely to have inquiring minds and pay more attention to the problems with statistics and look at far more data than the average US M.D. Plus they typically work in groups, which means their ideas are tested against other people regularly. They also publish in peer-reviewed research journals, which means they have to convince an expert in the field who is not part of their group that their research is valid and worth publishing. Medical researchers can have M.D.'s or have their degrees in related fields such as chemistry or biology or even statistics. It really is a different mindset from the typical practicing physician, though, and there is no reason why a researcher who has been seriously looking at the evidence should automatically have less credibility than somebody with an M.D. I have no idea what category (good, bad, mediocre) the wheat belly guy falls into, however.

But physicians in general are simply consultants - some are very good, many range from ok to mediocre, some are awful and should not come near patients. Most are reliable for very cut-and-dried problems such as dealing with a broken arm or a common infection, but chronic, complicated problems are off the radar entirely for most (especially since their listening skills are often lacking). Your own doctor may often be dead wrong in some of his or her advice to you, even if you are lucky enough to have the same doctor see you on each visit (many people hardly ever see the same doctor twice because of the way group practices can operate or because they simply move around a lot). There is no certainty in this life .. . My brother does see the same doctors again and again and yet not a one has ever suggested anything helpful for such an obvious problem as his difficulty walking. I keep telling my brother that he has to at least bring up the problem and tell them that it's interfering with his life, but he persists in thinking "the guy can see me limp into the office and doesn't mention it so it must not be a solvable problem". Part of this is the compartmentalization into specialties, but it's also just plain lack of curiousity. The occasional "curious" M.D. notices things and asks questions and readily admits "I don't know" and then actually tries to find out who does know. That's the nature of researchers, too.

Edited by: JWOOLMAN at: 4/23/2012 (15:42)
JWOOLMAN SparkPoints: (2,343)
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4/23/12 3:06 P

JESOLDANO - This may be dangerous to say :) but if you're allergic to wheat (a rash) but not other grains, there are indeed pizzas and pastries made gluten-free .... for sale even! I've seen both mixes and shells sold for pizza as well as the whole pizza, although if you're into baking you can make your own mix.

Is it only gluten-containing grains that are the problem with "wheat belly"? Or just wheat itself (including the older spelt and kamut?)? Gluten grains would be wheat, kamut, spelt, barley, and sometimes oats (if contaminated by wheat, but apparently one variety has something in it that can trigger a gluten reaction? What about gluten-free grains rice, corn, sorghum (milo)? Gluten-free pastas often use rice, many times blended with other non-grains such as potato, legumes, flaxseed, quinoa but also sometimes with corn. Can't remember if wild rice is considered a grain or not, maybe not despite the name, I remember rotating it on a different schedule from grains for allergy control.

JUSTBIRDY SparkPoints: (0)
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4/22/12 11:47 A

I follow Dr. Lustig's work, too, but I am opposed to his plan of taxing or legislating a certain way of eating. But I do hope moms and dads and school lunch officials take note and make the appropriate choices for our kids.

ROBINS-NEST Posts: 1,052
4/22/12 8:09 A

I gave up bad carbs in January. I feel great and have lost 30 pounds! I eat comfortably and don't count calories (I would be way over if I did). I feel wonderful...and that says a lot since I am dealing with a serious shoulder injury.
I just bought and perused through wheat belly BECAUSE I feel so good! Living Low Carb would be another good read. Did you see the 60 minutes show on toxic sugar? Youtube it!

All in all, you can choose to believe the book or not. There are so many resources out there that support this way of life and while they are just as many naysayers...I have not seen proof positive research on how gluten free living or smart carb living has hurt anyone that didn't have a serious underlying condition.

Your husband will thank you because you will become a much more creative and healthy cook!

JUSTBIRDY SparkPoints: (0)
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4/13/12 3:57 P

I just skimmed it, but I have been following Dr. Davis's blog for awhile.

4/13/12 3:08 P

I actually just ordered this book as I've been researching going grain-free. I'm hoping it gives me some good scientific backup to what I've read so far.

MARITIMER3 SparkPoints: (202,359)
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4/13/12 2:58 P

I've just read about this theory this week, and am interested in finding out more.

HOUNDLOVER1 Posts: 8,869
3/23/12 1:20 P

also feel free to join us on the "Wheatbelly" spark team over here:

You will find some recipes here as well. For additional recipes take a look at some of the other low-carb teams on spark. Search for low-carb, paleo, primal, atkins, to find the teams


3/23/12 12:34 P

I haven't heard of it. I am curious as I get rashes from wheat. I miss pizza, pastries, etc... but I don't like what they do to my skin. I will have to check that book out.

HOUNDLOVER1 Posts: 8,869
3/23/12 11:21 A

I agree, it is really encouraging to read these success stories. And there are hundreds of them, not just a few. People who have discovered how beneficial it is for them to cut out wheat and/or gluten or all grains are sharing the news, not because everybody will have the same benefits, but because there is lots of evidence that makes the more likely that obesity, heart disease and diabetes as well as many other diseases are caused by eating low-fat (and high carb), not by eating low-carb (and high fat). For those who don't know, William Davis, the author of "Wheat Belly" considers himself a preventive cardiologist. He does not make his money from performing open-heart surgery. Understanding what prevents heart disease is his specialty. If recommending a wheat-free and lower-carb and higher-fat diet to his patients did not work he would long have been out of business given that both the American Heart Association and the American Diabetic Association still recommend "healthy whole grains" and a high-carb diet.

GLC2009 Posts: 1,305
3/23/12 4:03 A

love hearing the rockin' good stories of low carb/wheat seems such an amazing thing that is going on.

GRACEMCDOG SparkPoints: (7,816)
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3/23/12 1:31 A

I read it first on my Kobo but then today I bought a copy at Costco (17.99 in Canada, hard cover) because I find it easier to use as a reference book in that form.

The salient points for me have to do mostly with diabetes, why and what I need to do to keep my blood sugar levels even. The information in regard to the effects of overproduction of insulin on all the major organs of the body is invaluable. This book is not simply about what the hybridized goat grass that is now providing 70% of all commercial wheat products does to the human body via appetite stimulation and an ability to produce opiate-like addiction, it is also a broad spectrum guide for health improvement through low carb eating. For me, this book managed to portray a gestalt of nutritional health I have not found elsewhere. I am planning to read Gary Taubes book next.

My husband and I have been completely grain, gluten free since February 12. I've lost 28 lbs and 6 inches from my waist. (I am 61 Y/O and have thyroid disease so losing weight is not something I have been able to do for many years.) He has lost 11 lbs and 7 inches from his waist with no other change than eliminating wheat. I eat 25-50 g carb/ 75 g protein and around 90 g fat per day. Calories tend to range from 1200 to 1700 but I am more interested in tracking carbs than calories. For the first time in over 20 years I no longer have daily episodes of debilitating hypoglycemia. I have no cravings, eat smaller portions and feel full, am never hungry. I have more energy than I can ever remember having. It's the first time I can remember not having wintertime depression. All my joints feel better. There is a good explanation in the book about what causes inflammation in the body.

I say 'Don't knock it 'till you've tried it. And..what have you got to lose?"

And before you get too bogged down in clinical studies and scientific research, read this article about confounding variables. Go on. I dare ya!

Give me honest anecdotal reporting and corroborating blood work- ups any day. Which, by the way, may be found in great abundance on the Wheat Belly Blog Success Story pages.
Anarie and Lulu, I wonder if you missed the 15 pages of references to medical studies and research at the end of the book, possibly.

GLC2009 Posts: 1,305
3/22/12 9:36 P

well, i tried and tried to get wheat belly from the library. right now there are 14 people on the waiting list. emoticon must be something worthwhile about the book. everyone wants to read it!
i gave up and bought an ebook. i don't know about reading the book on computer. i think i like having a book in my hands, but, i didn't want to wait anymore for the book. and if i ordered it, i would still have another week to wait.
anyway, i have it. i will read it. and then i can put 2 more cents of my opinion into this discussion.......................

SEACRONE Posts: 466
3/22/12 8:15 P

Why is a "researcher" more qualified to present an argument against wheat than a medical doctor? What qualifies someone as a "researcher"? I consider myself to be one as I read about various trials and studies and take scientific findings into account while forming an opinion on something.

Dr Davis does mention that whole grains are indeed "better for you" than refined grains. But the flaw in the logic of the whole grain promoters is that if something is better for you then MORE of that something is good for you. And that isn't sound thinking - it's more accurate to say whole grain is "less bad" for you.
For example... I think we can all agree that 100% apple juice is "better for you" than sugary soda, yes? Okay so following the same logic as the whole grain is better for you, should people drink MORE apple juice?? Sure it has more vitamins but it is really a lot of sugar. Yes it's natural sugar, but the body reacts to it the same way. So it wouldn't be smart to drink several glasses of apple juice daily, but it would be "less bad" than drinking several sugary sodas daily.

As for the belly business...Insulin resistance is what causes people to gain weight disproportionately around their waistlines/belly - any diet high in any kind of carbs whether it's beer, whole grain bread, or gum drops runs the risk of causing one to develop insulin resistance and insulin resistance leads to diabetes. When you have insulin resistance it becomes more difficult to lose weight.

When I got obese it didn't happen overnight, but I went from a normal healthy weight which I'd maintained up into my forties - to morbid obesity within a two year period. There were a LOT of contributing factors. It's never so simple as "calories in calories out" or eliminating any one food. Just as there are many factors for weight gain - there are many for weight loss. I spent many years listening to and following the advice to eat a balanced diet including a wide variety of whole foods. Eliminate or reduce refined sugars and flour.. eat brown rice and whole wheat .. keep fats low... exercise regularly.. And by following this advice I was able to lose 30 pounds over several years. But then I hit a plateau and stayed there and stayed there for three years. I was still morbidly obese and it looked like I was just going to stay that way. My nutritionist said that I'd reached the limit of what dietary change could do and I would really have to exercise a lot more to continue to lose. My doctor doubted that I was reporting truthfully - I must be overeating. I was really discouraged. I thought I was doing everything the "right way".

Personally - I think personal research is the BEST research. A study may say this or that, but until I experience the results in my own life the research isn't all that valuable. So I read "Why We Get Fat" by Gary Taubes last summer and I considered the conclusions drawn which were based on a lot of research. In the appendix of this book is the Duke University Medical Center "no sugar - no starch" diet. It is essentially a very low carbohydrate plan. Any low carbohydrate plan with tend to eliminate grains because grain foods have high carbs - doesn't matter if they are whole or not. Anyway - I started the plan in August and since it meant eliminating ALL sugar and ALL grains and starchy foods, I had some withdrawal and what is called "diet flu" or "carb flu" - point is I felt like crap for about 10 days... and then I felt wonderful ever after.
I was already grain free when I read "Wheat Belly" and every bit of it makes sense to me. Dr. Davis does get a little over zealous about the evils of wheat, but in my experience I have proof positive that eliminating grains has worked for me, and I'm talking about much more than just losing weight. My chronic irritable bowel syndrome is GONE. Not improved - gone. I've had no more heartburn or other digestive ills at all. My chronic acne/rosacea is also totally in remission... and the way... I've lost 33 pounds without feeling deprived or hungry or having any cravings.
Now I can hear the nay sayers protesting that I lost weight because I'm eating less food because I've eliminated particular types of food, but the truth is that my calorie and proportion of fat intake is actually quite high. Do I eat less? Hard to tell as I don't weigh and measure and obsess about fat and calories the way I used to when I was eating the "right way". My meals satisfy me and I stay that way a lot longer than when I was on a diet rich in grains.
It's been seven months now and I have from time to time had a little fruit or some starchy veggies. The only thing I'm totally strict about is no grains. I'm still feeling great and losing weight.

So DDSmith - You are already an expert in how to avoid gluten for your husband, so it might not be so difficult for you to make adjustments to your diet too. But definitely get the book and read it. It is NOT a diet book. That's one of the reasons why there's just a brief guideline about food and a handful of wheat free recipes. The book will teach you why the so called staff of life has changed in characteristics and why celiac disease is more common than ever and all the OTHER things that wheat can do to undermine your health that have nothing to do with weight.
As others have suggested - you could in the meanwhile go to the Wheat Belly Blog and read up on a lot of the information in the book. Take a look at the long and growing list of success stories.
Then decide for yourself if you think it's worth an honest effort. What have you got to lose?

VONBLACKBIRD Posts: 10,819
3/22/12 4:13 P

interesting. I may have to check it out.

GLC2009 Posts: 1,305
3/22/12 4:12 P

well, i have spent alot of time reading about the wheat and carb issues and there certainly is quite alot of research out there.
this is not just anecdotal stuff from one doctor and observations of his patients.
there's certainly alot of people out there that claim giving up wheat has helped them with health issues, most notably, i think is that across the board everyone says they no longer have acid reflux.
i think it's worth taking a wheat free month and seeing what it does for you.

RYOKOSITH Posts: 161
3/22/12 2:23 P

When I started my own lo-carb experiment, I actually had a ton more energy. Course, I was eating a lot of junk before I started. Headaches went away, vision seems less blurry at night, digestive issues went away, and my lower leg swelling left along with losing weight.

But those are just my results and with me going lo-carb across the board rather than just cutting one food item out. And when you do lo-carb, you need to replace the energy source for your body, so I added back in healthy fats.

I haven't read the book, but as has been pointed out above, I believe how you distribute fat is more genetically predetermined than by what foods you eat. Now what you eat and in what combination might influence HOW your body processes your food based on what hormones and enzymes are needed to break down what you ingest, but that's about it. It's one piece of the larger puzzle.

HOUNDLOVER1 Posts: 8,869
3/22/12 1:49 P

The carb flu is interesting. Do you mean symptoms just like the flu? Do you think it was carb withdrawal? I have found that my body went through carb or maybe just grain withdrawal for about 3-4 days when I felt more tired than usual, like a mild cold/flu, after that I had a lot more energy than before. This was not just giving up wheat, though, but all grains, sugar, beans and most fruit.

ELECTRALYTE Posts: 10,207
3/22/12 1:23 P

I'm not sure about "losing weight" part.
I read the book and gave up all wheat, sugar and ate very little fruit for a month. Like induction on Atkins.
I lost one pound, gained it back the next day. I suffered "carb flu" for about 2 weeks of the month. I didn't have the energy to exercise daily that I had before.
I don't eat that many carbs to begin with. Mostly from fruit and veggies so the experiment did reduce cravings and hunger and I guess that's the positive effect I got from it.
I am still researching.

HOUNDLOVER1 Posts: 8,869
3/22/12 12:23 P

I'm not trying to convince anyone but I would really suggest for anyone that you read the book or at least read the first 10 positive comments on the book on amazon before you dismiss it.
For people who have read the book and don't think what is presented is valid I'd love to have an honest discussion about it.
A lot of the info is also available on the wheatbelly blog, but you'll have to read a lot as the info is spread out over many blog posts.


Edited by: HOUNDLOVER1 at: 3/22/2012 (12:27)
SILVERSTAR1975 SparkPoints: (8,820)
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3/22/12 8:06 A

I am currently reading this book which I was able to get at my local library. I think there is quite a bit of good science to back up his claims. The downside of the book is that he gives you all the science and reason... but then it's basically up to you what you do with it. There's only a rough set of guidelines to follow and it's pretty fuzzy when in comes to all the other grains like oats and rice.

I'm not a believer in the whole grain movement. I think it has more to do with marketing and farm subsidies than actual health. I've been slowly removing grains from my diet and have noticed improvements such as less bloating, my acne has calmed down considerably, and I haven't had a rosacea flare up in over a year. My husband on the other hand doesn't overeat and regularly exercizes but a good deal of his calories are coming from wheat products. He's thin all over except for his belly. He looks about 6 months pregnant.

Edited by: SILVERSTAR1975 at: 3/22/2012 (09:30)
LULU8278 Posts: 313
3/22/12 7:52 A

I agree with Anarie.

HOUNDLOVER1 Posts: 8,869
3/21/12 10:26 P

I just found that there is a thread about Wheat Belly here as well and wanted to add that Dr. Davis does not base the book only on his personal observations of his patients. He has read many scientific studies on the topic and they are all listed in the endnotes to the book.
There is much more to this than the placebo effect.
Dr. Davis will respond to questions and comments on his blog and I think he is very approachable as a person. I'm not saying that every study he quotes will turn out to be first-class research, all research is subject to peer-review for sure, but many facts that are well-established are presented in the book. The important thing is for each person to do a risk analysis of potential benefit versus potential risk after reading the book from cover to cover. The risk (and cost) of eliminating wheat, incl. whole grain wheat, from one's diet is minimal, the potential benefit in my view is huge.

JUSTBIRDY SparkPoints: (0)
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2/11/12 12:19 P

I have never been tested for celiac but I do have wheat sensitivity, which I never noticed too much before going on low carb for awhile.

LAURA121212 Posts: 130
2/11/12 1:22 A

I don't have celiac diesease but I have a very strong allergy to wheat; I get a physical reaction to it, so I have to nearly eliminate it from my diet. The last time I was dieting, last year, I easily dropped 10 pounds by diet alone by simply eliminating wheat products from my diet (and sugar, of coruse).

So the theory makes total sense to me...Not that I'm an "expert" but wheat is bad for me personally.

Edited by: LAURA121212 at: 2/11/2012 (01:23)
JUSTBIRDY SparkPoints: (0)
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2/10/12 6:25 P

DD, I think Dr. Davis is a very compassionate and passionate doctor who really cares and listens to his patients. If you are concerned about the science, just try it. It is not all that difficult to eliminate wheat for a short time to see how you feel.

Edited by: JUSTBIRDY at: 2/10/2012 (18:26)
ANARIE Posts: 13,160
2/9/12 1:04 P

The problem is that he's not a researcher, and he makes all his claims based on his personal observations of his own patients when he "asked them to eliminate wheat, including whole grain products."

He doesn't have any data on people who weren't already sick.

He doesn't have any data on people who gave up refined grains but KEPT whole grain products.

He doesn't have any data on people who continued to eat wheat while getting all the OTHER treatments his patients were getting.

He doesn't have any data on people who gave up wheat but replaced the wheat calories with something else.

Most importantly, he doesn't have any data on people who weren't HIS patients and didn't KNOW that he believed eliminating wheat would make them healthier. We've known for centuries that if a person dressed as a doctor tells you, "this will make you better," it will, regardless of what "this" is. When that doctor is charismatic, the effect is even stronger.

All he's really shown is that people who give up a food lose weight. It really could be any food, and losing weight leads to all the other health improvements, regardless of how you do it.

Eliminating ANY food will have these results, because it forces you to stop and think before you eat. You have to say to yourself, "Does this have X in it?" Just that one-second delay is usually enough to make you say, "And why am I contemplating eating this anyway? I don't need it; I'm not that hungry." It's also about a gazillion times easier to tell yourself, "I can't eat this; it might have X in it" than to tell yourself, "I won't eat this; I need to lose weight." And when X is a really common food like wheat, it reduces your options so much that you end up pretty much only eating home-cooked foods planned for your diet.

I don't doubt that a wheat-free diet "works." But it works by making you eat less. Wheat has nothing to do with it.

JENG829 SparkPoints: (0)
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2/9/12 10:14 A

Wheat Belly is still on my Amazon wish list, but I do avoid wheat as I've noticed many positive changes by doing so. That is why the author, Dr Davis, started recommending it for his patients... When they dropped wheat, their health improved dramatically in many ways. And not just those with celiac.

Would also love to hear from those who read the book! But In case you or anyone else wants more information, check out his website:

BITTERQUILL Posts: 1,639
2/9/12 10:05 A

I don't believe that certain foods promote fat storage in certain areas, or that eating (or eliminating) particular foods will help you lose fat from certain areas. That's more genetically determined than anything else. There are plenty of people out there who eat wheat and other grains and have low body fat, or who store their weight in places other than the stomach area. If you eat grains in moderate amounts rather than huge quantities, and get plenty of other nutrition from other sources, you'll be fine.

DDSMITH66 Posts: 203
2/9/12 9:55 A

I just heard of this book this morning on the radio. I was reading the reviews of the book which encourages eliminating wheat from your diet all together. Has anyone ever read it or tried it? Any input. My husband suffers from celiac disease so he is wheat/gluten free, however the rest of us do eat wheat in our diets. The book indicates that the consumption of wheat attributes to belly fat. I could use to lose some fat around the belly and was considering trying to rid wheat from the family diet as much as possible. Please let me know your thoughts. Thanks.

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